Amy Blumenfeld, Author of THE CAST
[0:00]Welcome to Mom's Don't Have Time to Read Books, the podcast that features conversations
[0:15]with writers of all types.
[0:17]Today's episode of Mom's Don't Have Time to Read Books has been sponsored by the Crafts
[0:20]Studio, with locations in New York City on the Upper East Side and in Tribeca, the Craft
[0:25]Studio is a perfect place to bring your kids for some crafting fun.
[0:28]Crafts Studio NYC.com.
[0:30]I'm very excited to be talking to Amy Blumenfeld today.
[0:33]Amy is a first-time novelist, the author of The Cast, and she's written for The New York
[0:38]Times, HuffPost, Oh, The Oprah Magazine, Prevention and People.
[0:41]She has contributed to two nonfiction books and has appeared on MSNBC, Fox News and
[0:45]Other Media outlets, graduate of Barnard and Columbia University School of Journalism,
[0:51]Queens born Amy and now lives on Long Island with her husband and daughter.
[0:54]The cast was the gold winner of the 2018 IP Awards, which is independent publisher Book Awards
[1:00]and popular fiction, so thrilled to welcome Amy.
[1:05]Thanks so much for being on Mom's Don't Have Time to Read Books.
[1:08]Thank you for having me.
[1:11]Amy and I were just chatting about how frazzled I was, but anyway, now we're all common, ready to go.
[1:16]It's so long and sometimes happens.
[1:19]Okay, so you're the author of The Cast, which was beautiful and amazing.
[1:23]I really, really enjoyed reading it.
[1:24]I brought it on my trip to Greece, which was on my wish list forever.
[1:28]So to have this book, I can all my pictures with me.
[1:31]I feel like it was a guest on my trip, which is when I found this memory.
[1:36]Tell listeners, if you don't mind, what The Cast is about and how you came up with the
[1:41]idea for your book.
[1:42]The cast is about a group of childhood friends who rally around one of their friends.
[1:47]They were ninth grade when she gets sick.
[1:50]She has cancer and they realize that they're not doctors.
[1:54]They cannot heal her with medicine, but they can certainly make her laugh.
[1:58]So they create this Saturday Night Live Style video tape called Back a Night Live.
[2:03]And it's 90 minutes full of skits and line dances and ola more and silliness.
[2:08]And they just, they bring it to her in the hospital and they keep her laughing.
[2:12]And then 25 years later, she recovers.
[2:15]She's fine.
[2:16]25 years later, they reunite over the course of a July 4th weekend at a house in the
[2:20]Berkshires and, you know, nothing goes according to plan.
[2:24]And all of their lives are sorted across roads and they're there for each other.
[2:29]So you structured the book in the present with alternating viewpoints from all the different
[2:34]characters and they highlight some aspects of life and growing older.
[2:39]How did you craft the different narratives?
[2:41]Like did you have the message first, like follow your heart or did you have character types
[2:46]in mind first?
[2:47]How did you do it?
[2:48]It's a bit of a story.
[2:51]For this novel, the first thing that I did was create the characters.
[2:55]So when I turned 40, my friends and I were all sort of having these big discussions
[2:59]about where we were in our lives, what we hoped to accomplish, you know, discussing relationship
[3:04]issues and marriage and parenting issues and all of those, you know, career.
[3:08]And they're really interesting stories.
[3:11]And I had this idea for a book for years and it just wasn't taking off.
[3:17]It wasn't clicking.
[3:20]So what I decided to do was take the stories that were relatable that I felt like people
[3:26]like you and I would relate to and make a fun, thought-provoking, smart, but a fun,
[3:31]beat-read and book club fiction.
[3:33]And so I took the issues that my friends and I were struggling with and I put them into
[3:37]the book.
[3:38]But this book really started as a form of nonfiction when I was in graduate school for
[3:43]journalism.
[3:45]My professor said, you know, you need to write a master's project and you need to choose
[3:51]a topic that will keep your interest going throughout the course of the year.
[3:55]True to form, I had no idea what I wanted to write about.
[3:57]I left it to the deal for the deadline and it happened to be the day before the deadline
[4:03]was when I had my annual check-up at Sloan-Cattering.
[4:05]It's no secret that I had cancer as a child.
[4:09]And I went for my check-up and I'm sitting there in the waiting room and I have my little
[4:12]reporter's notebook and I'm jotting down different ideas and nothing is clicking.
[4:17]And the woman sitting right next to me was there with her daughter.
[4:20]It was their first visit at the hospital and the woman is, you know, nervous and she
[4:24]starts talking to me and she's like, oh, are you waiting for somebody?
[4:28]And I said, no, and I pulled up my sleeve and I showed her the idea bracelet on my rest.
[4:34]And she was sort of blown away and she wasn't blown away by me, Amy.
[4:37]She was blown away by, you know, what I represented, which was hope for herself and for
[4:42]her daughter and their family.
[4:44]And so I started talking to them, although her daughter was kind of quiet, but she was,
[4:48]you know, which was exactly the way I was at that age.
[4:52]But she was asking me all these questions.
[4:53]So after my appointment, I spent the remainder of the afternoon just hanging out with
[4:57]them and answering her questions.
[5:00]And I knew after that afternoon that I had a topic for my master's project and I walked
[5:05]back home to the other side of the park, just, you know, brainstorming different angles.
[5:11]And I knew that there was a story here about adult survivors of childhood cancer.
[5:17]And, you know, the, you know, the challenges that they all go through.
[5:21]And so I spent the next few months interviewing, you know, childhood cancer survivors,
[5:26]their families and loved ones, doctors, you know, social workers.
[5:31]And it was fascinating that really is this ripple effect that affects not just, you know,
[5:37]the patients, but their families and their friends.
[5:40]And so, a graduation, my professor said, you know, you really should consider turning
[5:44]this into a book.
[5:46]And I suspect he meant either a form of nonfiction, like a memoir or like a compilation
[5:51]of interviews.
[5:53]And I, for years, I would write, you know, I was interviewing people.
[5:57]I flew to California to interview some, I, you know, I'd write these little chapters.
[6:02]But it didn't come off the page.
[6:04]It just didn't click and it wasn't something that I would want to read.
[6:07]It was coming a cancer book and I didn't want to read a cancer book and wanted to read
[6:11]something that was fun and uplifting, but smart and thought-provoking and had a message.
[6:17]And so, like I said, when I turned 40, my friends and I were having these conversations
[6:20]and I said, why don't I create fiction?
[6:22]Why don't I try this?
[6:24]I've never done it before, but try writing a novel that based on these characters that
[6:29]were relatable but would take those messages and those good nuggets from the master's project
[6:34]and just sort of weave it all together.
[6:36]And that's how it came to be.
[6:37]Wow.
[6:38]What a story.
[6:39]That's so nice.
[6:40]What happened in the waiting room?
[6:41]Do you keep it?
[6:42]Did you ever keep in touch with them or anything now?
[6:44]No.
[6:45]It was one of those just, you know, meant to be moments.
[6:48]Oh my gosh.
[6:49]And so, the interviews that you did for the master's projects and all that did you refer
[6:55]back to them when you were writing like to, yeah.
[6:57]In my head.
[6:58]Yes.
[6:59]I mean, I didn't, I didn't go back and call these people.
[7:01]No, no.
[7:02]I'm in like years later.
[7:03]No, I mean, just like something through.
[7:04]Did you like pull it out?
[7:05]Was it on your desk?
[7:06]Yes.
[7:07]And it was just in my head.
[7:08]I remember all of them.
[7:09]You know, I remember going to those group meeting, the support group meetings and interviewing
[7:13]these people.
[7:15]And you know, there are these physical and emotional long term effects, you know, you're
[7:19]very fortunate.
[7:20]I'm very fortunate and the rest of us are to be in the generation that's surviving
[7:24]this.
[7:25]It used to be that it was a death sentence and now the curates of skyrocketed.
[7:29]But you know, there are side effects and treatment, you know, and the experience doesn't
[7:35]end when you walk out those hospital doors for your last treatment and you're declared
[7:39]in remission.
[7:40]So what are some of the effects both for the patient as a child and also for the family
[7:44]and loved ones?
[7:45]What are some things that use?
[7:46]So some of those things I tried to bring into the characters and, you know, and so
[7:51]back in her friends, they all sort of deal with it differently.
[7:54]Yep.
[7:55]You know, one character has a little bit of this obsessive compulsive disorder and everything
[7:59]needs to be, you know, organized and perfectly arranged because she couldn't control
[8:03]what was going on then.
[8:04]So she's trying to control her life now.
[8:07]Another character in the book sort of was drawn to religion and felt a need to just, you
[8:15]know, change her life and another character went the opposite direction and felt like how
[8:21]can I have an observant life and be raised in this when bad things happen to good people?
[8:27]And so you have a variety and then another character in the book says who's a straight
[8:33]student and super smart and she said, forget this, this is what's life about.
[8:37]It's about family.
[8:38]It's about, you know, being with someone and it's not about, you know, running and achieving,
[8:44]you know, all of these career dreams.
[8:47]And then another character has the opposite and she says, you know, I want to go for
[8:52]the gold.
[8:53]I want to have that business that I've always dreamed of because life is short and let
[8:56]me achieve this.
[8:57]And so they're all sort of going in different directions and that was sort of based on the
[9:02]people that I've spoken to.
[9:04]That's so creative.
[9:05]So you just took all the pads and instead of writing an article, like, here are the five
[9:09]things that can happen when, you know, it's more like, let me immerse you in these experiences
[9:14]and these motions and take you down the different paths.
[9:17]Yeah.
[9:18]The book was sort of sitting in me and I didn't know how it was going to turn out.
[9:22]But since, and I never grew up saying, oh, I want to write a book that was never part
[9:27]of the agenda.
[9:28]But when my professor said that's in me, you know, it sort of just, he planted a seed
[9:32]and it just sort of over the years, it didn't go away.
[9:34]Right.
[9:35]But you never, but you did go to journalism school.
[9:37]So you wanted to be some sort of writer?
[9:39]Yes.
[9:40]I'm guessing.
[9:41]Yes.
[9:42]Just not a novelist.
[9:43]No.
[9:44]What kind of writer did you start out wanting to be?
[9:45]Well, originally I wanted to be Katie Kirk.
[9:47]And I went, I focused on broadcast at Columbia and I did my internships at eyewitness
[9:53]news at the weekend today show.
[9:56]But then I realized when I was in school that, you know, it's a very different style.
[10:00]of writing broadcast for print and even within print in magazine versus newspaper and I just
[10:07]I wasn't as good at the broadcast. I you know it was a natural fit for me with a magazine
[10:12]style. Okay. So I went into magazines after. And then you freelancer for magazines. Yes,
[10:18]I worked at American Health was my first job and then I went to George magazine and then
[10:22]after George folded, I had been writing a piece for George about the children of former
[10:28]US presidents and what it's like to grow up in the White House. And so we folded with
[10:31]that issue and the editor-in-chief Frank Lolly, who's lovely, he said, you know, let me see if
[10:38]people would be interested. So he arranged a meeting of people. They said, okay, yes, you can
[10:42]continue to work on this for us. And then there was a story about the Bush daughters at the
[10:49]time. This was years ago and they put a picture of them on the cover and then linked it up to
[10:53]this piece that I had been working on. Oh, so it ended up there and from there I've started
[10:57]feeling like, it's great. And then you continue doing that even when you had your daughter or a little
[11:03]bit. Yeah, I pulled back a little bit, but I still did a few here and there. And then I decided,
[11:07]you know what, I really want to do this book and I didn't know how it was going to happen,
[11:12]but you know, when I turned 40, that's when I don't get together. And did you do anything to sort
[11:18]of teach yourself how to write fiction? Did you like go online and read an article about it or you just
[11:22]tried it or how did you try it? I actually found, I tried it and I realized, I don't know if it's
[11:29]just my personality or the journalism background, I needed a deadline. I needed an editor. I was
[11:34]not going to be one of these people who could write the entire manuscript and then give it off to
[11:39]an editor. I needed, you know, chapter by chapter, I needed some feedback. And so I found an editor,
[11:47]a coach editor who was terrific. And she, she did exactly that. She held my hand and said,
[11:52]okay, next Tuesday, you're sending me chapter one. So I would write that. I would send it to her
[11:58]and while she was, you know, going over it, I would write the next chapter and then we would
[12:02]switch back and forth. And that's how I got through the process. So then how did that all take
[12:08]took a year to write the first draft? Okay. And then it took a year to revise it. Okay. And then,
[12:14]you know, then the publishing process. And then what happened after that? So you had the
[12:18]finished manuscript. So they finished manuscript. And then that wasn't even the finished
[12:21]project, finished round one. It was round one and then there was round two. And then I,
[12:26]I, um, I sent a blind pitch to, um, my agent and, um, she went a Friday morning. I didn't think
[12:34]she would respond, but she did. And, um, she read it over the weekend and then Monday,
[12:40]she got back to me. And then we revised it even more. Um, and so, and then, you know,
[12:46]and then what happened? Then I want to know the whole story. The whole story. Yeah, I would.
[12:50]You know, it's interesting. Um, so we, she then pitched it to a bunch of the major publishers.
[12:58]Mm-hmm. We came close with two. We came to second realms with two of them. Then they passed both of
[13:03]them. So she said, well, we can continue to pitch it to smaller houses. But I was frustrated. I was
[13:09]looking at the timeline. And I want my parents to be able to, you know, Chef Nachas. I appreciate
[13:17]this and see this come to fruition and know that this was a dream that they were able to
[13:23]be there and cheer on for. And I said, you know what? I had a friend actually two, I knew two people,
[13:29]a good friend and then a friend of a friend who had published with a place called Sparkpress,
[13:34]which is a hybrid. And hey, I looked into it. What does that mean a hybrid? It's a mix of
[13:39]traditional publishing and independent publishing. And so they, um, really smart people who were
[13:45]veterans in the business. And they knew that they're needed to be a different model. And so I looked
[13:50]into it. I sent them my manuscript. And my friends had been very happy with that. Um, and had a lot of
[13:55]success. So I figured I had nothing to lose. I sent it to them. They said, yes, you know, and we
[14:02]took it from there. And it's been a partnership. It's been, it's been really a wonderful process.
[14:06]So I, I don't feel like I'm flying solo at all because they are there to guide me. They have a
[14:13]whole structure in place. They, they have artists who do the cover. They have, and you know, you
[14:18]discuss it with them. And they guide you with a publicity and they put me in touch with Anne Marie
[14:23]at Get Red PR, who's my publicist who's phenomenal. And so it's very professionally run,
[14:30]very smart people. And I, I'm very happy with the process.
[14:34]And have you since you published it, have you heard from other cancer survivors? Or just any,
[14:40]it just came out. I'm not, but um, not yet. Okay. But, you know, I'm sure you will. It came out
[14:47]two days. Yeah. Two weeks ago. Yeah. I was like, I didn't think, okay. Well, I'm sure you'll be flooded
[14:53]with, um, with feedback and everything. Um, speaking of your parents. So you, in the book,
[15:01]you do such a beautiful job with talking about Becca's parents. And there was one passage I wanted
[15:04]to read. Um, from, it was when Becca was, was shaking so violently from the chemo that her
[15:11]footboard was banging against the wall and chipped the pain. And you wrote, I remember mom
[15:15]throwing her five foot two inch frame atop my blankets, pinning down all 87 pounds of me with
[15:20]the force of a professional wrestler. And in a single breath, emitting the most desperate string of
[15:24]words I had ever heard, don't you dare leave me. God damn it, Becca, you stay with me. Do you
[15:28]understand? Don't you do this? And even, even, I mean, I was almost crying when I was,
[15:33]was reading this because I guess, you know, I could see my own mother in that situation. I could
[15:37]see me doing that with my own daughter. You know, was that a scene that came from your life or
[15:43]it was that that happened to you at all? Yeah. That was the day. Um, there were, you know,
[15:49]it's very vivid. I remember, you know, everything. And again, this is a work of fiction. It's
[15:55]totally inspired by my life. There were a couple of scenes that I took that I incorporated. That
[16:01]was one of them. Okay. Because it was a powerful scene. And I sort of, it captured, you know, the
[16:06]feeling of the moment. Um, but again, the, the friends I did not have a group of friends that were,
[16:14]you know, five friends that created a video. There was a video that was created for me, but it was
[16:17]by 40 people who were 10 families from our Senate God community and Queens, my parents, friends
[16:22]and their kids. Um, so that was one of the sources of inspiration for the book also. But,
[16:29]but yeah, that, that happened. And it was the day that they, they did the transplant, the bone
[16:34]marrow transplant. I just had a headache and I was tired. But, you know, if you close your eyes and
[16:40]you turn away and your parent doesn't know, that's not what happens. Have you seen lingering
[16:46]effects with your own parents? My parents are made of steel. They're incredibly, they're the best.
[16:53]They're the best. They're their sweet, kind, wonderful, intelligent people. Um, but I still don't
[16:59]know how they did what they did. And do they, does their relationship with your daughters that
[17:04]how you formed the character? It was inspired, but it's not exact. Well, it's, yeah. It's,
[17:09]yeah. I mean, it's, it's not an exact relationship. But how old were you when you
[17:14]found out you had cancer when you were 13? Because, did you do any writing at the time?
[17:20]No. About it. No. No. No. Uh, just normalcy. I wanted normalcy. I'm just focused on doing my
[17:26]homework, getting, you know, back to school, you know, just day to day. And I didn't. Um,
[17:33]and did you have to, you went through chemo and everything. I went through chemo and radiation. I had
[17:37]a bone marrow transplant. Oh my goodness. Yeah. I'm so sorry. No, it's not good. No, I know. I know.
[17:44]It's something like amazing and inspiring to overcome it, but that you've had to go through this.
[17:48]It's a lot. It's character building. I didn't know. I based on my, uh, aptitude at high school
[17:55]chemistry. I knew that I was not going to medical school. So there was a need to give back,
[18:00]and I knew that I had to give back in some way. And so if I can give back and just shed
[18:05]light onto these, you know, into this experience and to the ripple effect in the long-term
[18:10]effects, they're writing a book. Um, that's, you know, inspired by, but not exactly my experience
[18:15]and speaks to other experiences too. I tried to incorporate, you know, not just my experience,
[18:20]but other people's experiences into this. And I'm sorry to keep harping. I mean, this book is not
[18:25]just about no mess. It's in fact. Now I'm like magnifying that for in our discussions of our
[18:31]because I was interested in that. But, um, you could read this not as that type of book at all.
[18:35]it's, I mean, as you said, it's like a smart thought for looking B2 type book.
[18:40]No, I purposely did not write a cancer book. I wanted this to be, as you said, thought
[18:45]for voting. Yeah. Um, but it's, it's really about friendship and the power of, of friends to
[18:51]sort of buoy you and keep you afloat during these difficult times in life.
[18:54]I thought you did a lot of the, um, writing that really, I mean, I, I could see why you
[19:01]took this from your conversation with your friends because I feel like some of the marriage
[19:04]discussions about all the different relationships. Like, I feel like I've been
[19:10]part of some of those conversations. One of these, one was with Becca with her own husband
[19:15]and sort of her insecurity with him about her illness. Um, not to keep trying with the illness,
[19:20]but you wrote, um, I was a risky stock. Yes, I looked pretty in polish just like his friends
[19:25]while I was, but if you scratched below the surface, I was different. I wondered if deep down,
[19:29]he felt he'd gotten a lemon. Do you think that's something that, uh, the cancer survivor,
[19:36]like people who have been sick feel? Are you just any body, any body with baggage?
[19:40]I don't know. So too, specific to the cancer experience. That's true. Yeah. Okay. Well, anyway,
[19:46]I, uh, it was nice to see what they were. Yeah, you wrote it in a nice way. Like, you know,
[19:52]does, does you know like, anyway? Um, um, and then, you know, as you said, another couple
[20:00]comes Orthodox Jews.
[20:01]They went to a teen tour in Israel and yet ironically,
[20:05]you're not ironically, but just they end up
[20:07]having to go through 15 years of IVF,
[20:09]which you also wrote about in great detail,
[20:12]both through having a surrogate for one couple
[20:15]on IVF for another couple.
[20:17]They say they were, quote, deny the ability
[20:19]to fulfill the mitzvah to be fruitful and multiply.
[20:22]And you have faith sort of playing a big role in this book.
[20:25]Also, how do you think?
[20:27]How did you intend to have faith play into the story?
[20:33]I'm very familiar with Judaism.
[20:35]I grew up in an absorbent home.
[20:36]I went to a Jewish day school.
[20:40]My daughter goes to a Jewish day school.
[20:41]I lived in Israel for a while.
[20:42]So it's very much a part of my fabric.
[20:45]And I wanted to, you sort of write what you know a little bit.
[20:48]And so I wanted to, and I find it fascinating
[20:51]because I also see the people that I grew up with
[20:54]sort of going in different directions.
[20:56]Some are going towards and more observant lives.
[20:58]Some are going in opposite way.
[21:01]And I just, I thought they were fascinating discussions.
[21:04]And it's a day to day thing with Judaism,
[21:06]with Kosh, being kosher or even like there's a scene.
[21:10]And babies are us where this observant, you know,
[21:12]she's not, she's creating a baby registry.
[21:14]And she's now at 40 in the cusp of parenthood.
[21:17]And she's finally there after so many years of trying.
[21:21]And she's now a month shy of giving birth.
[21:25]And she says, you know, I really had a great upbringing.
[21:27]I wanted to do something was the way that I was raised,
[21:30]which is different than this observant life
[21:32]that I'm now leading.
[21:34]And so she's sort of questioning how she wants to parent
[21:38]and what does she want to expose her child to
[21:41]in terms of observance and how much.
[21:43]And so I find those conversations, you know, fascinating.
[21:47]And that was another thing I wanted to bring into the book
[21:50]was that there's no right or wrong answer to so many
[21:52]of these issues.
[21:53]There's a medical crisis.
[21:55]There's a marriage that's sort of on the rocks.
[21:56]There's a religious question of observance.
[21:59]And, you know, I grew up in a family of lawyers
[22:02]and everybody playing devil's advocate.
[22:04]You know, you know, there's this, you know,
[22:08]when you respect and love someone
[22:09]and how do you agree to disagree?
[22:11]And when there's no right or wrong answer.
[22:13]And so I sort of wanted to bring that tension
[22:17]into the book and how these people resolve
[22:21]these great areas when, you know, obviously things
[22:23]are not black and white.
[22:27]Your character Lex, who I think you made,
[22:31]that was like a particularly crystal clear,
[22:33]like I'm doing her and it would be kind of
[22:35]portrayal of a character.
[22:37]So she is in a marriage that looks perfect on the outside
[22:40]with like all the trappings that she ever wanted,
[22:42]the country club, the jewelry, the nice house, the kids,
[22:45]but she's miserable on the inside.
[22:48]And ultimately I won't give anything away.
[22:51]You know, you have to come to some sort of decision
[22:55]about this stage of her life.
[22:57]Anyway, she says, you'd look at us and never know
[22:59]how far we've strayed from what we were.
[23:01]We know how to smile for the cameras at school plays,
[23:04]which by the way you would see if you had Instagram or Facebook.
[23:06]But do we talk to each other?
[23:08]The moment the ballet closes our car door
[23:10]and we had home after a dinner party?
[23:11]No, I don't remember the last time
[23:13]the two of us were alone and laughed.
[23:16]And I feel like so many goals can relate to this moment.
[23:19]I mean, it's such a, you know,
[23:23]you can just see them sitting there in the car
[23:25]if it closed.
[23:27]And even the whole, like, you know,
[23:29]a lot of people have been saying how they feel
[23:32]with Instagram and social media, like that they feel
[23:35]worse about themselves because everybody looks so happy.
[23:37]So it's so happy.
[23:38]It's so happy and perfect.
[23:39]Yeah.
[23:40]I was even thinking yesterday.
[23:41]I had like the worst day and I was having some issue
[23:44]with one of my children, which of course
[23:45]just like d-rails everything, right?
[23:47]And I was like, no one would know because I went through
[23:50]all day yesterday with like a big smile on my face
[23:52]and dropping off and picking up.
[23:53]And it's only at the end of the day when I'm like alone
[23:55]in the kitchen where I'm like, I can like let it down.
[23:59]And I'm like, I'm not the only one doing this.
[24:01]Like everybody is running around.
[24:02]Not just saying I'm trying to hide anything.
[24:04]Like, you know, it's not a big, not, you know,
[24:06]it's just like what everybody has to do.
[24:07]We just like have to go through the motions
[24:10]and keep it all together and put us not ready.
[24:13]Anyway, that was a long time.
[24:16]Yeah.
[24:17]Did you like that scene in the car?
[24:19]Did you have any experience like that?
[24:21]That I completely created.
[24:23]Okay.
[24:24]All right.
[24:25]That I completely created.
[24:26]What do you think about this whole like need to sort of
[24:29]put on a happy face so to speak to the outside world?
[24:31]It's just too much pressure.
[24:33]It's just too much pressure, especially on kids.
[24:36]You know, my daughter just, just, she's 12
[24:40]and just got Instagram and it's only,
[24:42]and it's not even that she wants it.
[24:44]It's that she, you know, all of her friends are doing it
[24:47]and they're saying, why aren't you on them?
[24:49]So she, you know, it's just, it's ridiculous
[24:52]and so much pressure.
[24:53]And I just be authentic.
[24:55]And that's another theme in the book too, is that just
[24:58]listen to your gut, be who you are, you know,
[25:01]and just be authentic.
[25:03]Yeah.
[25:04]It's not that easy, it's hard.
[25:07]Also nobody wants to hear all your stuff.
[25:09]Do you know what I mean?
[25:09]Like if you go to pick up a drop-up
[25:11]and you're like, oh my gosh, listen to what happened.
[25:13]Yeah, how do you feel?
[25:14]Yeah.
[25:15]That's really asking.
[25:17]I guess it's like the power of having close friends
[25:19]and that's what you can talk to and close family
[25:22]and however you can, they keep you afloat.
[25:25]They keep you afloat.
[25:26]Exactly.
[25:27]You need a cast, everybody needs a cast.
[25:29]Oh, it's cheers.
[25:32]Everybody should get like little playbill, you know?
[25:34]I feel it in, you can like change.
[25:36]I feel like, especially over time, like not that anybody,
[25:40]maybe some of the lead characters go to supporting characters
[25:43]and then you characters come in over time, right?
[25:45]Anyway, you also, your character of Seth,
[25:52]I thought was interesting because he went to Princeton
[25:55]and was just like, go get her and whatever
[25:57]and then decided, you know what, I'm dropping out,
[26:00]I can't deal with this and sort of goes a different path
[26:02]at life, ends up a success in his, you know,
[26:06]with what he chose, but you know, with that
[26:09]where you're just trying to show just another reaction
[26:11]to, you know, a friend with cancer
[26:14]or just the many ways that life can go.
[26:17]Both, both.
[26:18]I mean, I know plenty of people who sort of,
[26:21]you know, thought they had to follow this,
[26:23]this certain path and drop themselves crazy
[26:24]to get straight A's and then ultimately
[26:26]we're just falling apart later on.
[26:29]Or, you know, yes, and or could be a side effect
[26:33]of seeing a friend at a young age struggle
[26:36]and face death and say, what is this really all about?
[26:40]And why am I putting all this pressure on myself
[26:42]to be the valedictorian of the class
[26:44]and to get into an Ivy League school?
[26:46]What's the ultimate goal here?
[26:47]Life is short.
[26:48]So I'm gonna enjoy it and I'm not gonna make myself crazy.
[26:52]Ultimately, he was smart and he figured out his path
[26:54]and he, you know, he didn't go to medical school
[26:56]and he became a physical therapist.
[26:57]But, you know, it all worked down in the end.
[27:01]Speaking of the end, the end of the book,
[27:03]I could not believe the way you ended it.
[27:05]I was like, oh, anyway, I'm not gonna give it away.
[27:09]But in general, like you chose to end it a certain way.
[27:14]Why, what, like why?
[27:18]What message, like what message do you want people
[27:20]to come away with?
[27:21]Like, if that particular thing had versus hadn't happened,
[27:25]is it more just like, my takeaway was,
[27:29]you never know.
[27:30]Let's appreciate it like.
[27:30]Is that what you were going for?
[27:31]All right, good.
[27:33]Yeah, all right.
[27:34]You hit it.
[27:36]Okay.
[27:37]Well, it was definitely like, you know,
[27:40]one of those times where I like sat up and bed
[27:41]and I was like, what, what happened?
[27:44]Oh my gosh.
[27:48]Tell me a little bit more you had.
[27:50]One of the characters have a baby via surrogate
[27:53]and that's, are you open to talking about it?
[27:56]So you went through this experience to yourself.
[27:59]And then what was it like, sort of writing about something
[28:02]that was so personal to you?
[28:03]I mean, obviously all of this is personal to you.
[28:05]Yeah, well, and I know you've written articles.
[28:07]I've written articles about it
[28:08]because I really think that's a fascinating rebel effect.
[28:12]Like I said, you know, it affects the patient
[28:14]and the family, but then it also affects the spouse
[28:16]later on and then the child ultimately.
[28:19]And so I knew that I never wanted a lie to my daughter
[28:24]about how she came into this world
[28:25]and we could not be more proud of the process.
[28:28]I feel incredibly lucky and grateful
[28:30]that it worked the first time.
[28:33]And I wanted her to feel that same pride.
[28:37]And so when she was about two and a half, I think,
[28:41]she was my sister-in-law as pregnant
[28:43]and a good friend of mine was pregnant.
[28:45]And she said, where are the pictures of,
[28:48]I want to see pictures of me when I was in your belly.
[28:50]And I said, well, you know, and I planted this seed.
[28:55]And I, because I wanted it to be on her level.
[28:57]And so I said, well, it was sort of like baking a cake.
[29:00]You know, daddy and I were the ingredients,
[29:02]but the oven was broken.
[29:04]And so we had to put your cake into somebody else to bake.
[29:08]And nine months later, you came out on your birthday.
[29:11]And that's when the cake was ready.
[29:13]So that's how it started.
[29:15]And then it grew from there.
[29:16]And so as she got older, she asked more and more questions.
[29:20]And then she, because we had pride
[29:24]and we're proud of the process,
[29:26]she felt the same way.
[29:28]And so a funny story is when she,
[29:33]she was in kindergarten,
[29:35]and they were having free playtime during recess.
[29:38]And her friends were all putting these baby dolls
[29:40]under their shirts and she didn't.
[29:43]And so her friends said, where's your baby?
[29:45]And she's like, oh, my friend is carrying my baby-
[29:48]Oh, my mom!
[29:49]They're like, huh?
[29:50]I thought you were gonna say she put the baby in the oven.
[29:53]No, no, she's so funny.
[29:54]Oh, she said, my friend is carrying.
[29:57]And so, peace.
[29:58]The next day, I pick up.
[30:00]One of the other moms comes up initially. So my daughter said, you know, she had some interesting story that
[30:07]Mia was telling her about how she was born. So my daughter aged five is like teaching that third-party reproduction
[30:14]Kind of garden and then that makes me think okay
[30:17]Well, then what's the responsibility that I have or that the school has because if a child who I'm instilling this confidence and
[30:24]Pride and then starts telling her little buddies in school and then the parents come to the principal and
[30:30]say, you know, why is my child learning about third-party reproduction? I can know her and that's a whole other ball of wax
[30:36]So it's just it's again. It's part of this ripple
[30:40]I thought was fascinating. Have you thought about doing a children's book with that theme?
[30:44]You should do that. I thought about that because like I mean, it's more and more common
[30:50]Oh, it's so much more common even now than it was you know, right 12 years ago and even just for kids who
[30:56]weren't born via surrogate, you know, they're very aware of kids, you know, and I love that and not like it's such a good analogy
[31:03]I can see the cake making one
[31:06]Anyway, it was it worked it worked it helped hard. So that's your next assignment
[31:13]No, I'm kidding, but do you have another book that you're interested in doing or what what are you thinking?
[31:19]I'm doing from here not that you need to be doing anything else this book just came out and
[31:22]The publicity you know part of this is sort of taking over which is great, but it's also ironic given that
[31:29]I'm sort of an introvert so that a lot of writers tend to be ready
[31:32]So it's I have to go out and you know do it, but I'm very grateful for all of it. I would love to write a sequel
[31:39]But I haven't started I mean I have ideas for it and I've started jotting
[31:43]Things down with the same cast same cast, but I would shift the focus
[31:47]I would focus on some of the other characters
[31:50]Not necessarily Nolan and Becca. Okay, but some of the supporting cast members. I would be cool
[31:57]But we'll see and what would what would put what exciting publicity events?
[32:00]Do you have coming up or are you looking forward to anything? We have a bunch of
[32:04]Of books signings coming up. We did doing your podcast, which is this is the best thing on the whole tour
[32:11]No, like I mean it's like a bunch of really fun
[32:14]Really fun things that we've done CVS and forever. No, but it's been great
[32:20]No, but I'm very grateful that it's you know that people are willing to have me like you. Oh my gosh
[32:25]It's my pleasure and I'm so glad we were introduced and I really enjoyed reading your book
[32:30]I really did and
[32:32]The characters really stuck with me in some of the moments in the scenes or you just they were so vivid so it was
[32:38]It was great and that it's such a like what you're doing
[32:42]It's like in mitzvah what you're doing, you know giving back the
[32:45]To the people going through this and this through the other survivors and not so this is a cancer
[32:51]But you know for any people who have gone through anything traumatic and childhood, you know
[32:55]This is just nice exactly and it's not just a cancer experience. It's it's it's any
[33:00]life-changing big experience that you experience with your friends at a young age
[33:05]Yeah, and just to see what happens to all of them later on. Yep
[33:10]So that was the goal and if I can you know shed some light on that and make it a fun read at the same time
[33:19]Check last week today
[33:21]Well, thank you so much for your time and for coming on the show. Thanks for having me course
[33:25]This episode of moms don't have time to read books. This has been sponsored by the craft studio craft studio
[33:30]NYC.com with locations on the upper east side and in Tribeca. It will fill all your crafting needs for you and your kids
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