Chioma Momah, FIRST DAY AT THE BIG SCHOOL
[0:08]Hi, I'm Zivi Owens, and you're listening to the award-winning podcast,
[0:11]Moms Don't Have Time to Read Books. Thanks so much for listening to my podcast.
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[1:02]page one book summer bundle by it is a gift housewarming if you actually go somewhere or just give
[1:08]it to yourself. Everybody needs a treat without a long spring page one books.com. Welcome to day two
[1:15]of the second week of the July book blast. This is the I guess seventh day in all of my 10 day
[1:22]July book blast with episodes I recorded throughout the quarantine, some quarantine related,
[1:27]some not all of which deserve to see the light of day before the summer comes to an end.
[1:32]Today is young readers day. So I have a collection of children's books, a middle grade,
[1:38]and all sorts of stuff that your kids might like and how interesting to hear from children's book
[1:43]writers, which is exciting to me because I actually sold two children's books to Penguin Random
[1:48]House that I'll be coming out in the next year or two. So I have a personal affinity for children's
[1:52]book authors. Enjoy these episodes. Chioma Moma is the author of First Day at the Big School. She is
[1:59]based in Nigeria where she is a regulatory sector lawyer and a member of the Nigerian bar
[2:05]and the Chartered Institute of Arbitrators. A children's book author, she started the learn program
[2:10]L dot e dot a dot r dot n program in schools where she speaks on reading and writing skills.
[2:15]She's passionate about encouraging working mothers through her blog,
[2:19]www dot shioma dot net. Hi to be. Well, welcome to mom's day. How are you?
[2:25]Folks, good. How are you? Thank you. I'm fine. Thank you. Great to be here.
[2:29]So where in Nigeria are you? I'm in Abuja. Where is that in Nigeria? Abuja is,
[2:35]Abuja is the capital. So why right in the middle, the capital students, well, it's not the Nigeria
[2:41]actually for the kind of in the middle. Awesome. Yeah. Well, from around the world, here we go.
[2:48]It's nice to be here. Oh, nice to be here with you. So tell me about the big school kids going
[2:55]to the big school. What made you want to write this book? Tell me the whole story of how you
[3:00]wrote a children's book and why about this topic and all the rest? Okay, so first off, I've always
[3:06]loved reading for gracious read up. But the one that I have in children, I noticed that most of
[3:11]the books where I do see enough Nigerian characters, people of color, people that they could
[3:16]relate to, which was the same thing I had when growing up all the books are either ended
[3:21]lighten or what's his name that I wrote about the giants. Just the same books I had read
[3:26]great enough. Yeah, the same books I had read going up. I know I read great books,
[3:30]I read Kyle. Real dog. There were amazing books, raw dolls. I love his books. So
[3:37]the same books I had read Charlie at the Chocolate Factory, the same books I had read
[3:41]great enough. But I was just seeing things by with African parents on Nigerian characters and I was
[3:46]like, okay, I would like to tell a story. I had things that they recognized Nigerian food, Nigerian names,
[3:54]Nigerian skin texture. So that was this. I wrote it for my children basically. I wanted my children
[3:58]to see a book where they had names and faces and events that they recognized. And then I thought of
[4:06]my eldest childhood memory was when I started left kindergarten, I started grade school. And for me,
[4:13]it was a big shock because I was living being a baby, because they kindergarten in LES school,
[4:19]I had, you know, you're too very little, you're like a child, you're like a baby. And then when I got
[4:24]into grade one, it was a bit scary because I thought they wanted us to all be grown up all of a
[4:30]sudden. And I just imagined that for other children, they would have the same issue, especially
[4:34]they're changing to a new school. They were transitioning to a different school. And they would be,
[4:39]you know, so uncertain. And, you know, like for us in Nigeria, I wish you lived kindergarten to grade
[4:44]school, you know, a lot of these change. You start wearing uniforms, you move to a different building,
[4:50]basically for me, I was like, you know, I'm sure there are other children who are wondering what
[4:55]it would be like to go to a different school. And all the mix of emotions they would have,
[5:00]meeting new friends, having a new teacher, just dealing with so much, so many new experiences,
[5:06]all at once. And then there would be excitement as well. So that was why I wrote that book. I wanted
[5:11]to be able to relate to children, for them to be able to see something they could relate with,
[5:16]children who are Nigerian children with Nigerian names, and then an experience which I think every
[5:21]child can relate to it. And they will every adult, because everyone has gone through that thing,
[5:26]where you have to, you know, get a new job, or go to a new school, or move to a new city. And
[5:33]you're just faced with like, oh, what is it going to be like? Will I like it? Will it be scary? Will
[5:39]I make friends? And that's really what, you know, that book was about. Just all those mix of
[5:44]emotions that everybody goes through when they're dealing with a new brand new experience.
[5:49]Well, it couldn't have come at a better time because my son, my four kids, my little
[5:54]this guy is starting kindergarten in the fall, which sounds more like a transition from K to
[5:59]first grade for you, and that it will be like a, you know, a dress code and a new school and a
[6:04]bigger building. And I mean, who knows if school will even start in the fall anymore. But that's
[6:08]the same, all of those feelings. You know, it's so great to have a book. And obviously there are
[6:14]some other books that deal with back to school. But like you said, having new characters and having
[6:19]a new point of view and the fact that kids in Nigeria have all are going through the same things.
[6:24]like people all over the world. Like, you know, when you say to yourself, like, oh, everywhere,
[6:28]yeah, like, I'm not the only one people, you know, I don't know, people all over the world. It's,
[6:32]it's one thing to think that, but then to have an example of like another child in a school in
[6:38]Nigeria, just it makes it all just seems so relatable. And then you don't feel so weird that you're
[6:42]all nervous yourself. Exactly. Exactly. We all have the same experiences. That's what I see.
[6:49]Everyone all over the world has their own example of that experience, but we all have similar
[6:54]experiences everywhere. That's true. And even though everyone knows that, I think everyone needs to
[7:00]see it to have it at home. Yeah. Yeah. Just definitely think it is not enough. So did your kids
[7:07]appreciate when you wrote it? Oh, they did. And then I based the main character on my daughter,
[7:11]had him as Orlando. So I named her Atlanta after my daughter. And then they were really excited
[7:18]to see. They were super, super excited. And then the funniest thing happened. Other people were
[7:23]excited as well. But I didn't expect that. Like I said, I wrote it for my children. And I said, okay,
[7:28]my children will read it. A few friends children will read it. Just a few people in my community
[7:34]would read it. You know, but then I had people who I didn't even know, people who I had to
[7:38]spoken to in years were like, oh, my God, we loved it. I put it on Amazon now. So people all over
[7:45]the world, basically, people in Canada, people in South Africa, people in the US, people in England,
[7:51]right to me to say, oh, I read your book. My child loves it. They could relate to it. But
[7:57]you know, they're transitioning to grade school or kindergarten or whatever. And they could relate
[8:02]to this story. And it was just amazing for them. And it just went to places I would never
[8:08]have expected. You know, I've gone to a different city. I've gone to different cities in Nigeria,
[8:11]where I've been told to come and read do book readings to children transitioning, just to kind
[8:16]of prepare them for that next stage of school. So yeah, you know, my children loved it. And a lot
[8:21]of other children loved it as well. So yeah, it's it's done really well. Thank goodness.
[8:25]Oh, that's great. What has it been like with your kids with a quarantine this spring? And like,
[8:30]what is it like now? They are tired of being, you know, they're tired of online school as one
[8:36]than I can see. They are tired of classes online. They are tired of, it's just a bit too much
[8:42]for them. They're happy that mommy is home because I'm home 24 seven now. So that's the best part.
[8:48]They have mommy home with them all the time. I don't have to go to work. But I think everyone is
[8:52]ready to be able to go back to school to learn. Yeah, but for them, the best part has been just
[8:57]been having mommy and daddy here. I'm baking a lot. I mean, the kitchen a lot. I'm playing games with
[9:03]them. You know, I do have hot scotch and play football together. And they're just happy to have
[9:07]me home. Yeah. That's the best part for them. What was your job before? Like, what's your day job?
[9:13]Oh, heavy lawyers. I'm a lawyer. So I work with the government. I work by government agency.
[9:18]The government office, I work in the legal department. So yeah, it was a busy nine to five jobs. So
[9:24]basically on a regular day if I got home by six or six PM, they would be happy. So just see me
[9:31]here every day. It's just like, oh, my goodness. They come and give me hugs like every,
[9:35]every one hour, you know, if you hug mommy, I love you mommy, can you take it so that you know,
[9:41]so that really is going to be hard for them when I have to go back to work. But yeah, I just
[9:45]enjoying the moment. I live in the moment. I glad, you know, I told somebody when you have family,
[9:51]you don't have that much to miss. You know, so you think of people who don't have families,
[9:55]who have to be by themselves, who have no siblings to play with or not, you know, or no,
[10:00]who know family, know children, or whatever.
[10:02]I guess I'm making the best of it
[10:04]the one we are the other time, but for technology.
[10:06]So we can talk, you know, do video calls
[10:08]and stuff like that, yeah.
[10:10]And so for your book,
[10:11]how did you find an illustrator?
[10:13]You didn't illustrate it yourself.
[10:14]Oh, I did not, that was the hardest,
[10:16]but I was in England at that time.
[10:19]I was studying, I was in grad school,
[10:21]what you guys call grad school in the States.
[10:23]And I was there with my two youngest children
[10:26]when I decided to write, to write the book.
[10:29]And I kept on looking for any illustrators,
[10:30]and it was really tough.
[10:31]I didn't even know where to start, to be honest.
[10:34]Well, luckily I thought somebody online
[10:35]who lives in, I think he lives in Vietnam.
[10:38]So I discussed my ideas with him, sent him,
[10:42]you know, the characters, descriptions.
[10:44]A lot of the things I wrote about,
[10:45]like, you know, he didn't understand the concepts.
[10:48]Like, well, you know, but he did really well.
[10:50]And we've done a second book, which he did amazing.
[10:53]And I worked in art art book,
[10:54]which was so tough working on art books together.
[10:56]So yes, I thought he made Vietnam
[10:58]his really, really gifted, and it was just amazing
[11:01]having to, you know, bring in these characters
[11:02]to life with him.
[11:04]Because like I said, I had to, you know,
[11:06]the whole concept of, you know,
[11:07]children with cornrows and their hair,
[11:09]he didn't understand any of that.
[11:10]But I had to show him lots of pictures
[11:12]and have lots of meetings with him.
[11:13]And, you know, he did a great job.
[11:15]It's just so amazing to me that you thought of this idea
[11:20]in England, you wrote it in Nigeria.
[11:24]You collaborated with a man in Vietnam,
[11:26]and now you and I are in Skype.
[11:28]And I'm here in New York and we're talking about your book
[11:31]because that people read all over the world.
[11:33]It's just amazing.
[11:34]Like, I always think about the power of books
[11:36]to bring people together.
[11:37]And this is just such a great example of, look at this
[11:41]and how your vision can make people feel better
[11:44]like everywhere.
[11:45]I don't know, it's just the coolest.
[11:47]I just think it's the coolest.
[11:49]Yeah, it's, it's, you know,
[11:51]technologies are amazing because we, you know,
[11:53]like, I tell people that every day, tell kids,
[11:55]you can tell a story in front of your friends at home,
[11:58]but when you write a book, it could go anywhere,
[12:01]literally anywhere in the world.
[12:03]And a lot of the books I read as a child
[12:05]where books like The Classics, you know, Little Woman,
[12:09]what's, you know, Jane Eyre's books,
[12:11]Hawkerberry Finn, Tom Sawyer.
[12:13]Those were books that were written somewhere
[12:15]and some corner maybe in the US or in the UK
[12:17]and people had read those books all over the world.
[12:20]So yeah, books are just amazing, really.
[12:22]How they bring people together.
[12:24]What are your next two books about?
[12:26]Okay, so my second book is called A Fun Day in the Museum
[12:29]and it's a series.
[12:30]So I stole with Lana and her friends
[12:32]and they go to see a museum.
[12:34]And in that book, I tried to talk about history
[12:37]because I found it because in Nigeria,
[12:39]there's a lot of children and taught history
[12:41]the way they should be.
[12:42]A lot of things I just glossed over.
[12:44]You know, I love kids, you know,
[12:45]a lot of kids don't know about great people
[12:47]in our historical past who have done a lot for this country.
[12:51]So I tried to bring up, you know,
[12:53]our founding fathers in that book.
[12:55]I put their pictures there, spoke about artifacts,
[12:59]spoke about, you know, stuff that has happened in Nigeria,
[13:01]the civil war we had.
[13:03]So I tried to put all of that in the museum.
[13:05]So as the children went going around there,
[13:07]the way discovering stuff about their country.
[13:10]And the third book, which is still far from finished,
[13:13]the children go to the village.
[13:15]Just to give it a example of what it is
[13:16]to go to the village, I live in a budget,
[13:18]which is the city where it's an urban city
[13:21]where everybody comes from some village or the other.
[13:25]You know, my father was born in some village down East.
[13:28]And most of my dreams every year,
[13:30]either Christmas time or Easter time or some time of the year,
[13:34]they go to visit their village.
[13:35]And it's really rural, it's really rustic,
[13:38]and it's really lots of fun, it's really different.
[13:41]So growing up, I did a lot of that.
[13:43]Every year we went down to the village,
[13:46]you know, to spend time with my grandmother.
[13:47]And I want to bring those memories alive
[13:49]for both of us who have those experiences.
[13:52]Now it is, it's quite as common.
[13:54]Children don't go to the villages that often,
[13:56]but because of all that date,
[13:58]it was really, really a great experience for us.
[14:00]I want to write about that, you know,
[14:02]so that children can see what village life was like.
[14:05]Because it was really fun, playing with gold,
[14:07]you know, going to the stream.
[14:09]But it was fun, it was really, really fun, you know?
[14:12]So yeah, so that's what that book is about.
[14:15]And then just meeting up with, you know,
[14:17]with your cousin who you haven't seen from all over the country
[14:19]and all over the world,
[14:20]but it was like a big, great homecoming.
[14:23]Everyone would come home for Christmas,
[14:25]and you would just see people you haven't seen in years.
[14:28]So yeah, so that I'm really excited about that project.
[14:31]And then also I'm writing a book for women as well.
[14:34]Yeah, something different.
[14:35]I'm writing about actually two books.
[14:37]It started out as one book,
[14:38]but I've had to make it two books now.
[14:40]I'm writing about women,
[14:42]who, women in history, who have done great themes,
[14:45]women like, I mean like Earhart's,
[14:47]women like Mary Slessell,
[14:48]who was a great missionary to Nigeria.
[14:51]We know how it does on amazing themes over time
[14:54]and the lessons we can learn from them.
[14:56]Yeah, so I'm really excited about that project.
[14:58]That would be, that book should be out in like another month
[15:00]or so, I'm really working hard on that to get it finished.
[15:03]Wow, good for you.
[15:04]Thank you.
[15:05]So this whole time of, you know, being at home
[15:08]has not, not affected your productivity
[15:11]in a negative way at all.
[15:13]Oh, at all.
[15:15]It's been, you know, it's been a blessing in this, guys,
[15:18]for my writing, because when I'm at work full time,
[15:21]I'm more engaged with work, you know, working as a lawyer.
[15:25]But now that I'm working, you know, at home,
[15:27]I don't have to do as much office work as I normally do,
[15:30]which I miss, but it's been a blessing in this, guys,
[15:33]to be honest, because I've had time to catch up
[15:35]about this project, time to speak with you, you know.
[15:38]So this guy, and just do other things that I really enjoy,
[15:41]you know, time to spend with the children
[15:43]and bond more with them, time to bake.
[15:46]And just, you know, it's been, it's been, it's been good.
[15:48]It's been a good time for me to be honest.
[15:49]And how do you come up with all the ideas
[15:51]for all of your different projects?
[15:53]Oh, inspiration.
[15:55]Yeah, I think for all of us,
[15:56]I especially from our childhood,
[15:58]for many people that are right,
[15:59]it's stuff that has happened to you.
[16:01]So like I said, for my first book,
[16:03]it was my experience, the root shock I got,
[16:06]starting, you know, grade school or primary school,
[16:08]like we call it here.
[16:10]And since I was now a big kid, all of a sudden,
[16:12]I had to wear a uniform,
[16:14]and I had to, you know, things just changed.
[16:17]So yeah, and then also my love for history
[16:19]inspired the second book.
[16:21]And then my love for just thinking back, you know,
[16:23]on village life inspired the third one.
[16:25]And for me, I do a lot of speaking to women,
[16:28]because I try to encourage women in law,
[16:30]because in our society, I think all over the world,
[16:32]women, you know, once they start having children,
[16:34]they feel that, you know, that's it.
[16:36]What are you going to tell women is so much more you can do?
[16:39]Yes, you can be a great parent, you can be a great mom,
[16:42]but you can also do stuff that you love as well,
[16:44]a part from parenting, a part from raising your children.
[16:48]So I just try to encourage them to look, you know,
[16:49]whatever it is, whatever career path you want to do.
[16:53]Like you say, you don't have time to read,
[16:55]what you do have time to read,
[16:56]you can make time to do other things
[16:58]if you really want to.
[16:59]So I just try to encourage women,
[17:00]and with this latest book I'm working on for women,
[17:04]I just, you know, I was talking about all these women
[17:05]who had so many things, I gave them.
[17:07]They had, you know, there were gender issues,
[17:11]there was race discrimination that they had to deal,
[17:13]but there were so there were so many issues,
[17:15]but yet they were able to do those things
[17:17]that they dreamt of doing.
[17:18]So just to, you know, encourage women to be like,
[17:20]go for your dreams, you can do it.
[17:22]So yeah, so that's where my inspiration for my writing comes
[17:25]from is from, you know, things I like to inspire ladies
[17:28]to do in the, you know, in real life.
[17:29]Go for your dreams, don't let motherhood be,
[17:32]don't let motherhood look like something negative.
[17:34]It's a beautiful thing.
[17:36]Being a mother should not make you be any less
[17:39]of a human being or not accomplish any other thing
[17:42]that you need or you desire to accomplish.
[17:44]Think a lot of people need to hear that.
[17:46]So thank you for that.
[17:48]That's great.
[17:49]Thank you.
[17:50]What do you like to read?
[17:51]What are you reading now?
[17:52]Any good books?
[17:53]Oh, I'm reading.
[17:54]There's this book, the book I'm reading now is called
[17:56]Deborah or Deborah.
[17:57]Like I said, I like being inspired by women
[17:59]as I inspire other women.
[18:00]So I'm reading about Deborah who was a great judge
[18:03]in the Bible.
[18:04]And just reading about all the amazing things she did,
[18:07]how she went to war with this mighty man,
[18:10]how she won, how basically if she hadn't gone with them,
[18:14]they would not have won that war.
[18:15]So yeah, I'm just reading stuff about, you know,
[18:17]inspiring people.
[18:18]And another book I just read recently,
[18:20]which was really amazing that I love history,
[18:23]was a book about sea woman.
[18:24]So women in Korea, I think.
[18:26]And yeah, that was really interesting.
[18:28]Just to see how women were so strong,
[18:31]how they, you know, they made a living
[18:35]and still had to come back and be mothers.
[18:37]So yeah, a lot of the books I'm reading about
[18:39]as a aspiring woman, basically, yeah.
[18:40]So what advice would you have to aspiring authors?
[18:45]Aspiring authors, your story is in you.
[18:47]You have your story writing.
[18:49]You don't have to go searching for it.
[18:51]Think back, think of your memories.
[18:52]Think of your experiences.
[18:54]Think of those things that really touched you.
[18:56]You know, when you were a child
[18:58]or it would in adulthood.
[19:00]Think of those experiences that experiences that stand out
[19:02]to you and you can tell a story from there.
[19:05]You don't have to copy someone's story.
[19:06]You can be original.
[19:07]We all have stories inside of us.
[19:09]Hundreds of stories waiting to be told.
[19:12]So just think and think what story would I like people to hear?
[19:17]What is that authentic story I have inside of me?
[19:19]And yeah, and that's my number one advice.
[19:21]Your story is in you, think about it.
[19:23]And then don't be afraid to write.
[19:25]You're writing might not be perfect.
[19:27]But then we have editors.
[19:28]We have people who can help you.
[19:30]You know, so just start writing.
[19:32]Start today.
[19:33]Don't put it off to tomorrow.
[19:34]Start now.
[19:35]Love it.
[19:36]I'm going to go right right now.
[19:37]I'm going to just go.
[19:38]Now that you said that, no, I don't.
[19:40]I don't tell you that to me.
[19:42]But I would like to.
[19:44]Well, thank you so much.
[19:45]I'm so glad you came on my podcast.
[19:47]I'm so glad we can connect across the world
[19:49]about our kids and books and the power of not feeling alone.
[19:54]I'm so happy to be here.
[19:55]It's my pleasure.
[19:56]Oh my gosh.
[19:57]So how's New York?
[19:58]How's New York in the heart?
[20:00]You guys doing?
[20:01]Um, okay.
[20:02]I mean, I'm not in the city right now.
[20:03]So I haven't been to my home in the city now for, I don't know, three and a half months or so.
[20:08]So I miss it, but I don't know.
[20:10]I mean, slowly going back to normal, it's a bitsy steps.
[20:14]Yeah.
[20:15]I think the worst part is that, you know, well, I know, I think, yes, I think the worst
[20:19]part is over, but I think the worst part, the lingering side effects are that everybody looks
[20:23]at each other as though they could be the enemy in a way, right?
[20:27]like you don't know who has coronavirus and so that's the saddest part.
[20:32]Yeah.
[20:33]I agree.
[20:34]I'm like, you know, I like to like hug people so much and, you know, have everybody
[20:37]over and, you know, be very well, I don't know and now I don't know.
[20:41]It's created this distance that when my whole thing is connection.
[20:45]So it's sad, saddens me, but that's the worst part.
[20:48]Other than that, my family is healthy, my close friends, people who have had it are better.
[20:52]So I don't know.
[20:53]How about you?
[20:54]Yeah.
[20:56]I can totally relate in my city churches are open now, but, you know, I'm not going
[21:00]to church.
[21:01]I told my husband, the whole issue, you know, going to church, going out and meeting
[21:05]people, you want to hug them, you want to see how are you and give them a great big hug
[21:09]and nobody's doing that right now.
[21:10]And that just seems weird and I can't, it's just a bit painful for me, so I'll rather
[21:14]just stay home and wait, I'll wait till now to be because, like you said, everybody's
[21:20]suspicious.
[21:21]You see your friend and you can, you know, like standing there, oh, hello.
[21:24]And that's just not me.
[21:25]I'm such, you know, I'm big on physical connection.
[21:28]I'm very social as well.
[21:30]Yeah, so that for me is the saddest part as well.
[21:32]It's just, you know, the other day I went out to get some groceries.
[21:35]I saw my very good friend and I just said, hi, and that was, and that, you know, normally
[21:40]I would give her a big hug, you know, so I was sad.
[21:43]I couldn't do that, but yeah, I'm hoping that things will slowly get back to normal
[21:48]in my take time, but yeah, I'm just grateful.
[21:51]I can go for all the opportunities I've had during this period, I can go that my family
[21:56]is well, like you, I had a few people who were ill and they're all fine.
[22:00]I have family all over the world in the US, Seattle, Houston, MD, and everybody's fine,
[22:06]you know, so that's, that's something to be thankful for that everybody's in good
[22:09]help.
[22:10]And yeah, I can't wait for this to be over.
[22:13]Me too.
[22:14]Well, maybe one day you and I can get together in real life and give each other a hug.
[22:18]That would be very nice.
[22:19]That would be awesome.
[22:21]All right.
[22:22]Now we have some goals.
[22:23]Long term goals.
[22:25]Yeah.
[22:26]Well, thank you again, and this has been so nice, and thanks for sending me your book
[22:32]and for helping my little guy through his transition in the fall, so to school, so thank
[22:37]you.
[22:38]Thank you.
[22:39]It's such a pleasure.
[22:40]I'm glad he liked it.
[22:41]I'm glad you liked it.
[22:42]I was great to be able to talk to you.
[22:43]And thanks for all the great job, you know, work you're doing with authors.
[22:46]Just getting women to read more.
[22:49]It's pretty amazing.
[22:50]Thank you so much.
[22:51]Thank you.
[22:52]Thanks.
[22:53]Bye bye.
[22:54]Thanks so much for listening to Young Readers Tuesday, part of my July book blast.
[22:58]I hope you've enjoyed it.
[23:00]Thanks again for listening to my podcast.
[23:02]Moms don't have time to read books.
[23:04]If you liked this episode, please follow me on Instagram at Zippy Owens and at Moms
[23:10]don't have time to read books and sign up for my mailing list at Zippy Owens.com, so you
[23:14]can always hear about the latest things I'm up to.
[23:17]Thanks a lot.
[23:18]Thanks so much to page one books for sponsoring today's episode.
[23:20]I hope you'll all check out my summer beach bundle at page one books.com.
[23:24]Thanks so much to Steve and Ryan at Texture Sound for the sound editing.
[23:28]And thank you to Morning Moon Productions for providing this fantastic intro and out
[23:32]trim music.
[23:33]Thanks for listening.
[23:34]You can always email me at zippy at zippy Owens.com.