Dr. Jill Biden, WHERE THE LIGHT ENTERS
[0:08]Hi, I'm Zivi Owens and you're listening to the award-winning podcast,
[0:12]Moms Don't Have Time to Read Books. Thanks so much for listening to my podcast. If you like what
[0:16]you hear, please follow me on Instagram at ziviowens and also at Moms Don't Have Time to Read
[0:21]Books. Thanks so much for listening. Enjoy it. I am so excited to be partnering with rockets
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[0:59]and it will be live August 1st. And I hope you enjoy it and I'll be doing the box right along with you.
[1:05]I did an Instagram live with Jill Biden this week, which was so amazing and I hope that you all
[1:11]really enjoyed this episode because I had the best time getting to know her. Jill Biden is a community
[1:17]college professor and served as second lady of the United States from 2009 to 2017. And for those
[1:24]of you who have picked up on who she is, she's Jill Biden's wife and perhaps will be the next
[1:30]first lady. We'll see what happens. During the Obama Biden administration, she advocated for
[1:34]military families, community colleges, the fight against cancer and the education of women and girls
[1:39]around the world. She continues this work today through the Biden Foundation, the Biden Cancer
[1:44]Initiative and the Bow Biden Foundation for the protection of children. Dr. Biden is married to former
[1:49]vice president Joe Biden. Her book is called Where the Light enters building a family discovering
[1:55]myself. It's a memoir, a New York Times bestseller and just came out in paperback. So definitely
[2:01]read it. I read it. I half read it and half listened to the audiobook of it. I sort of interchanged them
[2:06]and that was also really neat because she reads it herself. So enjoying. Hi. Hello. We are in the middle
[2:13]of a gigantic storm. We've had a tornado watch all weekend. We've lost our power. I mean all
[2:19]morning. We lost our power three times. So that's why we're a little bit late. Oh my gosh, don't worry.
[2:25]I, you know, we have a tornado warning here too. And I'm like, don't go out at one o'clock.
[2:32]Where are you in DC or New York? We're out on Long Island in New York. Oh, gosh. Yeah. How about you?
[2:38]Where are you today? Delaware at our Wilmington home. Well, thanks so much for taking the time.
[2:45]Congratulations on your paperback release. Do you see how I'm wearing your matching sweater today?
[2:50]I guess I should have been, you know, twins.
[2:54]And I'm into it. This is such an amazing book. I mean, what a story. What a life you have
[3:00]led. It's truly remarkable. And you can just tell how, I mean, the sounds are trait, but like
[3:05]you're such a good person. And it comes through and like every story that you tell it's just so nice
[3:10]to get to know you now in person as well or, you know, this way. Well, it's nice to meet you. And
[3:16]thanks for doing this. Of course. So much to discuss. First, I just wanted to hear a little more
[3:21]about how much you love being a teacher. Because that's one of the things that came through so
[3:25]clear in the book. You wrote, I realized early on that teaching was more than a job for me.
[3:30]It goes much deeper than that. Being a teacher is not what I do, but who I am. So tell me a little
[3:35]about your love of teaching and what about it gets you so fired up. I've been teaching, I think this
[3:41]is year 36. And it's just, it's my career. It's, you know, what I love doing. I mean, I've, my
[3:49]grandmother was a teacher. And so I think for me, it's a sense of community that I feel in my
[3:56]classroom that they're like a family to me. I try to create that as that first week of school. I
[4:03]get to know everybody's names. I have them get to know one another. Because I teach writing and
[4:08]writing is so personal that I think that they have to feel that they know somebody else in the
[4:14]classroom to read what they've written. They have to know, you know, their stories. And it makes,
[4:20]it creates, writing creates a vulnerability, I think. So I get to know my students really well. And
[4:27]I hear from my students all the time, they're texting me and emailing me. And even though we're
[4:33]not in school, back in school yet this semester. But I have to tell you, Zavi, I'm taking
[4:39]certification so that I can teach online. Should I become first lady? Oh, that's exciting.
[4:46]Yeah. So that's my dream. But I did that all the eight years that I was second lady. And I
[4:53]loved every minute of it. And we made it work. And so, you know, I'm hoping we can make it work
[4:58]again. So would the online component be because schools might not open or because the first lady
[5:04]can't teach in a public place or what would the, what would the impetus be? Well, you know,
[5:10]schools, I mean, we're in such a precarious time right now. You know, every day my phone is going crazy
[5:18]with my friends and my friends who are teachers and saying, what should we do? What should we do? And
[5:25]we have to listen to the scientists and the doctors. And when they tell us, it's safe to go back,
[5:31]then I think that's okay to go back. But right now, you know, we just don't, I mean, the public schools
[5:38]don't have a lot of them don't have the funding. And so they don't have, you know, maybe they don't
[5:44]have the masks to extra masks. I mean, how many you know yourself? I mean, kids forget everything.
[5:50]You know that they're going to forget their masks. But so we need to have a supply of masks in every
[5:56]classroom. We need to socially distance. And you know how many kids are in a classroom. I mean,
[6:01]25 to 35, it's going to be so, you know, it's hard to do that to move these desks and then
[6:09]address all the students' needs. So, you know, people, I mean, that's the big thing, right? We're
[6:14]in August and school is about to start. So I think that's the thing on everybody's mind, like, what
[6:21]do we do? This is literally all I talk about. Well, there we go. I have four kids. They're at three
[6:28]different schools. You know, they all have different plans. I don't know what I agree with, what I
[6:32]don't. It's so hard. Every parent has to not only listen to the national advice, but the actual
[6:38]individual school advice and then listen to your heart. It is so hard. I mean, this is like
[6:41]a tough time in this, and for teachers too. I mean, educators as well. So, I agree. I mean, that's
[6:47]what I, why I say I'm hearing from a lot of teachers who are saying, gosh, we think, you know,
[6:53]right now, unless the doctor say it's okay to go back, you know, should we really go back
[6:59]because then we have to go back into our own homes and, you know, take care of our families. So,
[7:05]you know, there are a lot of decisions, and that's why, you know, leadership is so important, isn't it?
[7:10]Really, to know what to do, to give us advice and, you know, tell us the path to follow somebody we trust.
[7:17]Somebody in the comments is saying that you should be the Secretary of Education.
[7:21]No, I love the classroom, and that's where I want to be.
[7:31]Okay, fine. You wrote so beautifully in the book about parenting your way through uncertainty
[7:39]and through sorrow. And I feel like uncertainty in particular at this time is what basically everybody
[7:44]is going through every which way. You said parents are supposed to be the ones with the answers,
[7:49]the ones who can tell you that everything is going to be okay. But how do you make your
[7:53]children believe that things will work out when you aren't so sure that they will, when you have
[7:57]no answers on the sadness and confusion? So, wherever you come out on this, do you have
[8:03]what are we supposed to do? What do you think about it? You know, my mother was always so strong
[8:09]for me always. And I always went to her with whatever problem I had or if I was trying to sort
[8:15]of things out, she always gave me such great advice. And I depended so much on her. And so,
[8:22]I think I want to be, my mother was such a great role model for me that I want to be that
[8:27]for my children. And so, I try very hard to take the lessons from her book, you know, and be strong
[8:33]and try to be resilient and try to just love them. You know, just love them through the top times.
[8:40]And I think that's the role of a good mom. I think another thing that came through in your book
[8:46]is just by a lot of candles to decorate your table. Because clearly, like, I want to go to
[8:52]your Thanksgiving. And yeah, you would probably say that because you're like such an open door
[8:59]ballsy. But, you know, the importance of the small rituals too. And all the traditions of family,
[9:04]I feel like was something that came up over and over and how little things like having a catalog
[9:10]in the back seat of the car, driving an antique it, like these things. Sometimes the sum total of all
[9:15]these traditions make up a family, right? Yeah. And don't kids love that. I mean, they love the,
[9:22]you know, the things that you do over and over again year after year, like at Easter,
[9:27]I get those, the clear jars and I fill them with jelly beans. And then I put the candles in the
[9:34]jelly beans and I put them down the table. Or just things that they always, you know,
[9:40]they always look forward to. And even if they're a little bit corny or the kids still love them.
[9:45]And I don't know about you. I'd still do stockings at Christmas. And they still love the,
[9:50]the really funny stuff, the candy bars you stick in or we have a tradition where we always stick
[9:54]in orange. My grandma did this always stick in orange in the toe. So the kids come
[10:00]I don't laugh at it, but if I didn't have that orange in there, they would be the first ones to tell me. So I think kids just love, you know, that kind of, I don't know. I think it provides structure. It provides comfort. The things that they're used to.
[10:15]I totally agree. Yes. And when everything around you changes, you've been down to the stores in your neighborhood, like everything is.
[10:21]What do you give me an example of something you do for your kids? We always do birthday breakfast, which is something that my parents used to do for me.
[10:30]In fact, my husband is like, what's up with everybody eating cake for breakfast?
[10:37]We always do that. We have a cake and I decorate the whole kitchen. I have all the gifts waiting. So when you come down in the morning, it's like a whole big thing. There's like a banner and yeah, in fact,
[10:48]In the next room, they're so into these celebrations now. It's a little else that like goes on these days that we're celebrating the end of their pretend camp, which is just like one friend each.
[10:58]And we have a cake and my son now has put party hats all over the table. So after this, we're going to like have a celebration for that. So everything is a paper. I like should support the paper goods industry. Like I should invest or something.
[11:10]Well, you know, today it's funny because today is Natalie's 16th birthday. She's both oldest.
[11:17]And so every year I have a pool party for her. So we had what, of course, we Joe and I had to like stay away. We went down. She brought some friends over and they they went swimming and I do the same thing. We have cake. We have balloons.
[11:34]You know, it doesn't matter if your kids are 16 or they're 36. If you don't have those balloons, it's like they're so disappointed. So, you know, I love that. So I love that birthday cake idea because what difference does it make if they
[11:49]And that's one of the beauties. I think of being a grandmother is when they come over and I have dessert for dinner. I say, I don't care. Eat your dessert first. Like what do I care? They're going to get all the dinner anyway. So what difference does the order me?
[12:03]But that's the beauty of being a grandmother. I don't think I'd ever do that as a mother.
[12:08]I feel like this pandemic has made me act more like a grandmother.
[12:14]Rules that I like were so strict at now. I'm like, I don't know. Is it a big deal? So yeah, because you have to be fun and creative because it's tough for them.
[12:24]You know, this pandemic is really tough for our kids and they don't really understand a lot about it and everything is upside down and it's really tough on them.
[12:35]Yeah, absolutely. How do you maintain this sense of closeness and family and tradition while your life is also on such a public state? It's like your intimacy and then you're like out there everywhere and your husband is out there everywhere. How do you like come back?
[12:53]What do you like do at night to stay normal? Do you sit around and watch TV? How do you go back and forth, I guess, from such a public to the private?
[13:01]You know, you have to make your family and your private life. I mean, you have to maintain that. You have to make it up a priority.
[13:10]And so I think when I'm at school, you know, just my heads at school or when I'm doing something a second lady, I was, you know, my head was totally there.
[13:21]But then you can't, I mean, you have to be very conscious as a mom, you know, to make sure that you do all the things that your kids expect, you know, the calling them or sending a card or sending a quote like I sent a quote to Natalie this morning and it said a Walt Whitman said that some people are full of sunshine to the very last inch and I said, Natalie, that's you, that's who you are.
[13:51]And it is who she is and that's who her dad was, that's who my son Bo was. And so I wanted to send that to her and, you know, she sent me back a very sweet email. And so anyway, you know, you have to make time.
[14:04]You have to really think about it. You can't just let time go by or a day go by or, you know, you have to be vigilant at being a good mom and a grandma, right?
[14:15]I mean, isn't that, I mean, not that you're a grandma, but, you know, I mean, being a good mom, you have to make, you have to be conscious about it.
[14:23]It's true.
[14:24]And oh my gosh, honestly, my heart broke when you wrote about losing Bo and just how open, authentic, honest, I'm so sorry that you've gone through this and your whole family's lost.
[14:37]I just my heart just breaks for you. And the way you wrote about it in the book and how that there is nothing you can say. You're like, I don't have the words for this. All I can say is to other people that have been through it that you're not alone.
[14:50]And sometimes that is what you would say.
[14:52]Anyway, it was just absolutely beautiful and just so heartbreaking. And anyway, I just want to extend my, you know what, Suvi, I really feel that because you love your children so much. I think you know, or you can imagine how painful is to lose a child.
[15:08]And I mean, you can't even let your mind go there. You can't even let your head go there.
[15:14]So the thing that I found that Joe and I did was we tried to find purpose. And so after we were in the administration, we started the Biden Cancer Initiative.
[15:26]Because every American family is going through many American families, most have someone who is experiencing cancer.
[15:35]And it's so tough to go through it. And I went through it with, you know, with my mother, my sister had a stem cell transplant and then bow.
[15:44]But I can't even tell you how many people that I connect with, you know, weekly. I mean, a lot of people who say who have gone through the same thing.
[15:54]I have to tell them, you know, you just have to find purpose to to be able to go on.
[16:02]Because you have to make something of the life, you know, that you've lost and in both case, you know, brain cancer. So we're, you know, this I'll keep going. I'll keep going with this. No matter no matter what happens in our future, I will still be in the fight against cancer.
[16:19]It's just so awful. I'm so sorry.
[16:21]In fact, one of the things that really struck me in your book too was how you talked about your requirement essentially to compartmentalize and how you had to just put it aside and I felt like that resonated so well because
[16:35]so much rather because everybody has to do that to some degree or another, not necessarily through the awful things that you've been through.
[16:43]But even something smaller that's really on their minds and yet you have to do it. You said, and your point in particular was I wasn't disingenuous when I smiled at rallies or campaign stops.
[16:55]I just had to teach myself to forget for a little while the parts of me that were hurting so many of us public figures are not have to learn how to lead these double lives work doesn't stop because your father is sick deadlines don't go away because your friend is dying.
[17:09]We never know what's behind someone's smile what hardships they are balancing with their day to day responsibilities.
[17:17]Tell me about your ability to compartmentalize and like how how we all do this how we all can just step it up when we have to and how can people do it when they're feeling so lousy.
[17:29]Well, you know, I think as moms, I mean, we you have to do that you can't let your and in my professional life, you know, I had to walk into that classroom every single day a smile on my face because as you walk into the classroom.
[17:46]At first that instant that I walk in there that's so important it sets the tone for the class.
[17:52]And if I walked in and I was upset or or grouchy, you know, that would permeate so every day I would walk in positive and with a smile on my face knowing that my students were going through some pretty tough times and I teach a lot of refugees I teach a lot of immigrants.
[18:12]A lot of my students are in the United States by themselves because they've lost their entire families due to wars or circumstances in other countries.
[18:22]And so I had to be there for them, you know, and like I said, my classroom is my sense of community and I owe them that as a professional as a as a as a friend as their teacher as a professional.
[18:37]I think I owe them that.
[18:39]Like those back to you're saying you have to have a purpose like this whole sense of purpose and doing things for others and just making it all matter requires that level of stepping it up, such a degree.
[18:50]Oh my gosh.
[18:51]Writing a book is something that I know you've written children's books as well is a memoir or something that you always thought you would do or has it been in the back of your mind or.
[19:02]Or tell me about writing, you know, after we were in the administration.
[19:06]I met so many amazing people and did so many amazing things that I thought I have to write about that because I have to tell these stories.
[19:14]But when I talked to the publisher and presented the book they said no no we don't want that we want a book that only you can write.
[19:22]And so they said tell us about your family and there's so many blended families now and so that's what I decided that only I could write about how I married Joe and he had two children and how I became a mother to bone hunter.
[19:38]And then later on we had our daughter Ashley and how I use my own family as a road map to sort of navigate you know what I valued in my growing up to sort of guide me to being a mother and instant mother by the way an instant mother to to little boys and I grew up with four sisters.
[20:00]So I was so used to girls and fighting over makeup
[20:04]and who has the comb and the hair brush.
[20:06]You know, all the things girls do.
[20:08]And boys were like totally different for me.
[20:12]And you know, I write in the book about the snake story
[20:15]where the kids came in and I'll never forget it.
[20:18]Mom, mom, come here, come here.
[20:21]So I go running down the steps
[20:22]and they're holding this net.
[20:24]And I look in the net and it's a snake.
[20:27]And I screamed and I ran back upstairs.
[20:31]But like they were so proud of the snake
[20:34]that they had caught this snake.
[20:35]And they wanted to show it to me.
[20:37]You know, those sorts of things
[20:39]that I really had to get used to as a new mother.
[20:42]So there were a lot of fun, fun stories.
[20:45]And boys, I think, I don't know.
[20:47]I don't know how, if you boys are girls or if you-
[20:49]I have two of each.
[20:51]Okay, then do you think boys and girls raising them
[20:54]or is a lot different?
[20:56]I mean, I feel like just all my kids are so different.
[20:59]I feel like they all, even within the genders.
[21:02]But yes, there are some things that are just so, yeah.
[21:06]So it's just funny and different.
[21:09]So they were a lot of fun.
[21:11]I mean, you know, raising them.
[21:13]I went through some really interesting times.
[21:18]I'm sure you could have written many more books
[21:20]just about that.
[21:21]Yeah.
[21:22]Is it something that you would want to do again?
[21:24]Like, would you want to write about what it's like to be
[21:26]on the campaign trail?
[21:27]Like, would you want to write more about being grandmother?
[21:30]Like, I could just see you doing so many books.
[21:32]Because you're not always.
[21:33]So, you know, I love writing.
[21:35]And I journal every day.
[21:38]I mean, most days.
[21:39]And that's what I suggest to a lot, you know,
[21:42]people that I meet to my students, to other friends.
[21:46]Because we are in such a different time,
[21:49]I mean, this pandemic.
[21:51]And I try to tell my grandchildren,
[21:53]I want them to journal.
[21:54]Because I never want them to forget what they went through
[21:57]during this time in good ways and in bad times.
[22:01]Like, right reflections of how did you feel?
[22:04]How did this pandemic change you?
[22:07]How did it change your view of the world?
[22:11]What do you want to see in the future?
[22:12]Because of having been through this pandemic.
[22:16]So I hope your kids are, they don't even have to write it.
[22:20]If they want to do it through art, you know,
[22:22]some of my grandchildren are very artistic.
[22:24]Or they want to do a video and record it.
[22:27]But I don't think we should lose really the essence
[22:31]of this experience.
[22:33]Even though it's a hard, you know,
[22:35]this illness is so horrible.
[22:37]I think we have to think of ourselves
[22:40]and what we went through and how it changed us as who we are.
[22:44]Or as I who we were.
[22:47]I think my daughter is chronicling this through TikTok,
[22:50]which might now go away.
[22:51]So I think we need some different outlets.
[22:55]Yes. Yeah.
[22:57]Do you have any advice to aspiring authors?
[23:00]Aside from journaling a person?
[23:02]Well, I say right from your heart.
[23:04]I mean, I tried to write, I read so many memoirs.
[23:08]And when I finished a lot of them,
[23:11]I thought, I don't really know that person.
[23:14]And I thought when I thought about writing my own memoir,
[23:18]I thought my leaders are going to expect me
[23:22]to sort of expose my heart
[23:25]and get to know me for the woman I am.
[23:28]So I hope, you know, I hope that came through in the book
[23:32]because I didn't want it to be superficial.
[23:35]I wanted people to get to know me.
[23:38]And, you know, I still, you know,
[23:40]like I just wrote my children's book,
[23:42]Joey about my husband.
[23:44]And I'd love to write another book.
[23:46]I just, because look what we're going through.
[23:49]I mean, there's so many things happening
[23:51]in the world right now
[23:53]that just so many things that are challenging
[23:57]yet interesting, sad, yet you find joy,
[24:02]you feel joy like so much more than you,
[24:06]you ever allowed yourself to feel it before
[24:09]because we've seen such loss.
[24:12]So I would, you know, I'm writing every day.
[24:15]So who knows?
[24:16]Oh, it has.
[24:18]I mean, you might have a much bigger thing on your plate,
[24:20]you know?
[24:21]Thank you.
[24:24]Oh, Emily, no point.
[24:26]So thank you so much.
[24:27]Thank you for coming on my show.
[24:29]Thank you for giving me an opportunity to wear this sweater
[24:31]again.
[24:33]No, I'm getting it.
[24:34]But seriously, I read a lot of memoirs too.
[24:36]And this is really one of my favorites
[24:37]because of just what you're saying
[24:39]because it was so open.
[24:41]And I could tell, like, you're just the way that you see him
[24:44]from the book talking to one.
[24:46]And that's like, that's just amazing.
[24:48]That's all we have is being who we are.
[24:50]It sounds so stupid, but anyway.
[24:52]I've loved getting to know you.
[24:53]Thanks for doing this.
[24:55]You too. Thank you so much.
[24:56]Thanks.
[24:57]Thank you.
[24:58]Okay, bye bye.
[25:00]Thanks again for listening to my podcast.
[25:02]Moms don't have time to read books.
[25:04]If you liked this episode, please follow me on Instagram
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