Natalie Portman, NATALIE PORTMAN'S FABLES
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[2:22]Oh my gosh, I have the best time interviewing Natalie Portman, who I have been a fan of for as long as I can remember.
[2:28]She is one of my favorite actresses of all time, and now she wrote a children's book, and it was just beyond a thrill to interview her, and she was so real and awesome, and I just loved it.
[2:38]Natalie Portman, born in Jerusalem, Natalie Portman is a graduate of Harvard University.
[2:43]She's an Academy Award-winning actress, director, producer, and activist, whose credits include Black Swan, Jackie, and the upcoming Marvel movie Thor, Four, Love, and Thunder.
[2:52]What you may not know is that Natalie fluently speaks six languages.
[2:56]English, Hebrew, Spanish, French, German, and Japanese, and was also a trained ballet dancer explaining her brilliant work in Black Swan.
[3:03]Natalie's debut children's picture book, Natalie Portman's Fables, is a modern take on timeless, life lessons told through insightful
[3:11]feelings of classic stories like the tortoise and the hair, the three little pigs, and country mass and city mass.
[3:17]My kid's favorite, by the way, was the three little pigs in case you were wondering.
[3:20]A lifelong fan of books, Natalie runs her own book club and shares her favorite reads on her Instagram feed, using the hashtag, what, Nat reads.
[3:28]Welcome Natalie, thank you so much for coming on moms, don't have time to read books.
[3:32]Thank you so much for having me.
[3:35]I read Fables to my kids, they were obsessed, they loved it, and I don't say that all the time.
[3:41]I have lots of children's books and sometimes, you know, your kids just like relate to ones or they don't.
[3:46]And my daughter was like, you're talking to the woman who wrote this new three little pigs, so they thought that was the coolest.
[3:51]I appreciate that so much. Thank you.
[3:54]So what inspired you to write Fables to reimagine some of these classic fairy tales from our youth and do them over. What was that about?
[4:05]Well, I was reading books to my kids and I have a boy and a girl and I realized that, first of all, for my girl, the kinds of presents she would get, the kind of books that were given to her were, were often like feminist kind of baby books.
[4:21]And I was like, why didn't my son get any of these? You know, like, the boys needed as much as the girl.
[4:28]So I felt like, oh, I want something that's going to be everyone will read.
[4:33]And the classic books that I had been reading both of them, of course. I started noticing that all of the characters were predominantly were male.
[4:43]And so I thought, oh my goodness, well, the books that both of them are reading are telling them to prioritize male character stories over other stories.
[4:52]And so I thought, what if I took some of these classics and just made it more reflective of the world, you know, where there's lots of genders in the, in the animal kingdom and let the stories that are still morally resonant, you know, the morals that really resonate today still.
[5:12]Like the tortoise in the hair and the three little pigs and the country mass in the same mass, those could could still hold up and even have new meaning in today's world.
[5:23]So now the bad guys are actually bad women. Is that really a good message? I don't know. Like the wolf is a woman. Are we happy to be including her in our clan here? What do you think?
[5:35]I think that the more women are seeing as human and capable of anything capable of being good or bad capable of being smart or not smart or strong or lazy like the more possibility women have to just be human and be seen as human first.
[5:53]And judged by their character, their virtue, their accomplishments not by their gender. That's where we reach a quality. So of course, I mean, it's like the RBG quote of like putting women on a pedestal is just another kind of cage paraphrasing, of course, that's not the exact exact quote, but you know, when people say, oh, women are much better than men or that's, that's another harmful stereotype, even like masquerading as a compliment.
[6:21]I feel like throughout your Instagram, you've done such a good job of trying to highlight all different types of women in all different areas and talking about the things that are really important, like everything from Serena Williams and why are there not as many women tend as matches today than men's tend as matches to different political candidate to homeschooling everything.
[6:43]It's like digging deeper and deeper into every industry. Like it's not even, it's not about authors. It's about like really critical thinkers and tell me about how you started doing this whole interview series as well.
[6:57]I mean, it's really, I've just been led by curiosity, I guess. And in the things I'm interested in, I thought if I have this way of talking to people directly, then I might as well talk about what I'm curious about, learn things and share what I what I'm learning or the people I'm lucky enough to me. And so whether it's about food, which is super interesting to me.
[7:20]And obviously, of course, the environmental impact of food is really interesting, but making it delicious and fun at the same time, or whether it's writers because I love reading and it's such a great opportunity to get to discuss books like writers after you read them.
[7:36]And it's like the coolest opportunity or activists who from whom like I feel like one, the big change for me, I'm going to social media was like it opened up my understanding of the world in such a new way.
[7:50]I was exposed to so many incredible people doing so so much really like world changing world's bettering work. So that's been really wonderful to as an opportunity. And yeah, it's been really interesting.
[8:03]Like social media obviously gets a bad rap, but I feel like I've met people from all over the world, like I can talk to an author in Nigeria about how they're handling COVID and I can talk to them in an outlet like it's there's no there are no barriers anymore and you can connect with people anywhere. It's really I think it's one of the biggest perks.
[8:24]It's all how it's used it seems and also it is, of course, it can be very addictive. It can be very like, you know, living in a virtual state as opposed to like the real life state, but I think, you know, if you're able to use it in moderation, certainly as an incredible like portal into so many different places we wouldn't normally have access to.
[8:48]And back to your cooking, by the way, because now I'm like feeling totally shamed like not only do you have like your whole professional life, but now and all these great, you know, activist thought leadership type interviews and you're like cooking all these amazing foods to like my husband and that's fun.
[9:05]I'm like not so lasagna that looks amazing.
[9:09]You're so sweet, but please not at all like my husband is really the cooking in the house. He really cooks well and I'm kind of I'm very amateur, but like I really like it, but I think that for me while like sharing it is because I'm not very skilled.
[9:26]So I know if I can do it, like anyone can do it and I'm usually doing it in like 15 minutes like holding a child in my hand. So I'm like, okay, like this recipe, you can do like any if I can do it, you can do it.
[9:39]It's not complicated and I feel like those are the kind of mom things we need to share with each other because like that's how we get by.
[9:47]It's those like tips that we spread from mom to mom.
[9:52]It's true. The whole like whisper culture of this is how we do it. Yes, I'm upheld by comments like.
[10:00]does it, and little tips.
[10:02]The messages in Fables, though,
[10:04]go beyond typical kids' books, I would say, typical,
[10:09]like you have so many things.
[10:10]And I feel like, I don't know if you intentionally put in
[10:13]all your values and just shove them in a little children's book.
[10:17]If you started with the values,
[10:18]you're like, how can I fit these in?
[10:20]Oh wait, oh wait a minute.
[10:21]But there were so many things.
[10:22]Like, see, you don't need all that stuff.
[10:24]True friends are more than enough.
[10:26]And you have all these things.
[10:27]Like, sometimes more isn't better.
[10:29]A bragger cannot persevere.
[10:31]A life lived attentively is the completist
[10:33]to have strong foundations.
[10:34]You cannot be lazy.
[10:36]Waking up early is an energy booster.
[10:38]You want to have friends who will stand by yourself.
[10:40]Like these could be, I could be like reading a quote book
[10:43]at the checkout line with like, you know,
[10:45]little flowers or something.
[10:46]But instead, they're interspersed in the book.
[10:49]It's like very clever how you did it.
[10:51]Yeah, that's really nice.
[10:52]Well, I think, you know, when you have a clear audience,
[10:55]and here it was like for my children,
[10:57]like I was like, what do I want to give them
[11:00]intangible form of like what I think is important?
[11:03]And so, I mean, it's not all in there,
[11:07]but certainly there's a lot that I care about
[11:10]that I wanted to give to them, you know?
[11:12]And secondly, I find that reading books to kids,
[11:16]it's kind of the only time I read books
[11:19]over and over and over again, where I'll read,
[11:22]because my kids both have had favorites over the years.
[11:26]And, you know, they make me read a book 100 times in a row.
[11:30]And so it really gets into you.
[11:32]And as a parent, like you kind of want that to be meaningful.
[11:37]And so there's certain things I feel like it even wrote
[11:39]for myself, like in the tortoise and the hair
[11:41]that was like honey moved slowly,
[11:43]but it is the sweetest, a life lived attentively
[11:46]is the completus because it's like the attention.
[11:49]It's so noisy.
[11:50]You've been running around all the time.
[11:52]And then, like, you know that when you really pay attention,
[11:56]when you really focus, when you really spend time,
[11:59]when you take things slowly, it's like a true expression
[12:03]of love and meaning, like that's where they're like most
[12:07]fulfillment.
[12:08]And so it felt like both for them and also for myself.
[12:13]I was like, what do I need to remember?
[12:15]And also, what do I want to like in view in my children?
[12:19]And how did, so I know in the back of the book,
[12:21]you included a portrait that your mom had done
[12:24]of you and your brothers, kids, I think it's so sweet
[12:26]and you have this whole big shed out of her.
[12:28]That's my kids.
[12:29]Oh, that's your kids.
[12:31]Oh, my gosh.
[12:32]Might you send in my daughter that she drew?
[12:34]Oh, so sweet.
[12:36]So tell me about, like, what did she do, right?
[12:39]What do you think like she did in her parenting to you
[12:42]that gave you the values that you're now passing on to your kids?
[12:45]Or maybe not, maybe it's like a reaction against,
[12:48]she's just the most attentive and the most focused
[12:53]with kids and the most, like, I mean,
[12:56]she was like that with me and I'm an only child
[12:59]and then she's like that with my children now.
[13:01]Like, you know, you couldn't even imagine like,
[13:03]I feel like I'm constantly running through lists of stuff
[13:07]that I have to do and like trying to like fold laundry
[13:11]and cook dinner and get the kids homework at the same time.
[13:18]I mean, not get their homework.
[13:20]I can imagine.
[13:20]I can imagine doing it.
[13:22]I mean, while I only have one kid doing homework right now,
[13:26]it's my little one is in preschool.
[13:27]But really, it's definitely like, I feel so scattered as a mother.
[13:32]Like, I feel like that's like the central characteristic.
[13:37]And my mother, I always felt that she was just so focused
[13:42]and present and attentive and like, yeah.
[13:46]So I try and conjure her energy, which I don't have.
[13:53]I'm more all over the place.
[13:56]Yeah, I'm the same way.
[13:57]And sometimes even when I'm with my mom,
[13:59]like she'll be on her phone or something.
[14:01]And I'm like, I feel so hurt.
[14:03]It's so silly, right?
[14:04]I'm like 44 years old.
[14:05]And I'm like, but we only have like an hour together.
[14:07]Why are you on your phone?
[14:08]Like, what do you do it?
[14:09]What is so important?
[14:11]And I think it's the same thing.
[14:12]It's like this, this like let someone occupy 100%
[14:16]of what you're doing, right?
[14:18]And that's what like great conversation is about, right?
[14:20]You just pay attention.
[14:22]And that's, I don't know, there's just nothing like it.
[14:25]And when you don't feel like you're necessarily getting that.
[14:27]And I try to remind myself of that when I'm with my kids.
[14:30]Like, how do I feel when my mom seems distracted?
[14:32]And here I am like, two, two, two, two, two.
[14:33]So yeah, I mean, my husband always says it to me
[14:37]that like the phone, these like smartphones
[14:40]were supposed to make our lives like so we could have more
[14:43]free time because you know, you could like kind of be
[14:46]portable and like whatever.
[14:48]But then instead it just makes us like work all the time.
[14:51]It makes us like half working all the time, half on our phones,
[14:54]all the time, half not present all the time.
[14:56]And so it's really, I think it's like kind of the,
[15:00]one of the biggest challenges of modern
[15:02]parenthood among the other, you know,
[15:05]that is in things.
[15:07]Let's take it out every so often.
[15:09]I'm like, maybe I'll just try to email on a computer today.
[15:12]Like, let's see how that works.
[15:14]And actually really good.
[15:16]I've done that a few times where I've taken breaks
[15:19]and just taken an email off of my phone.
[15:21]And it actually makes a huge difference.
[15:23]Yeah, you can be so much more productive on a computer
[15:26]with like an hour than all day long.
[15:28]These like little dribble dribbles of emails
[15:30]that never stopped, but not that I will change my behavior.
[15:33]But you know, and tell me about this new LA women's soccer team.
[15:37]What is that about?
[15:38]That's so awesome.
[15:40]Yeah, we're so excited.
[15:42]So Angel City Football Club is our official name.
[15:45]And we'll want you in 2022.
[15:48]Like that's when we'll start playing games.
[15:50]And it's just really thrilling
[15:52]to bring women's soccer to LA.
[15:55]There's two men, men's soccer teams.
[15:58]And we have such incredible players in this country.
[16:00]We have like really the best players in the world
[16:04]and the most popular sport in the world.
[16:06]And it's super exciting to get to celebrate them
[16:10]and amplify their virtuosity because they're extraordinary.
[16:15]So it's really fun.
[16:17]It's an incredible group of people doing it.
[16:19]It's Alexis O'Haney and Serena Williams.
[16:22]And a bunch of actress friends, I adore Jess Chassis
[16:27]in America for Eva Longoria, who's doing Duba.
[16:31]Just countless others.
[16:33]And it's been an end like sports legends, like Billy Jean King
[16:38]and Lindsey Vaughn and 14 former women's national team
[16:41]players like Mia Hammond, Julie Foudy and Abby Womback.
[16:45]It's just like insane and insane group of people.
[16:49]It's so exciting.
[16:50]So you all like get a box and you can hang out every game, you know?
[16:53]That's how I do it.
[16:54]You have to get through this pandemic and then we can all hang off by.
[17:01]Oh my gosh.
[17:02]Actually, I was just chatting with my husband
[17:04]as I was coming down here.
[17:04]And I was mentioning your soccer team.
[17:06]And my daughter, who we were fitting to bed, was like,
[17:08]wait, women have soccer teams.
[17:10]And I was like, yeah, we're making a soccer team.
[17:12]She's like, can we have football teams?
[17:14]And I was like, no, not football.
[17:15]And she's like, OK, basketball.
[17:17]That's like, we watched that much sports here.
[17:20]I don't know if it's with us.
[17:21]But I don't know somehow that was like really inspiring.
[17:23]She's a great little athlete.
[17:25]So anyway, I know it's a lot easier for our girls to have professional careers
[17:31]to aspire to if they are extraordinary athletes
[17:36]to have athletes to look up to and admire.
[17:39]And also for boys, it's the same thing
[17:41]we're talking about with the book.
[17:43]It really had kind of similar impetus
[17:46]that I was inspired to have this soccer team
[17:49]when I saw my son watching the Women's World Cup.
[17:51]And he was looking at, you know, Alex Morgan and Megan
[17:56]Rapino in the same way that he looks at Nessie or Ronaldo.
[18:00]And I was like, that's changed.
[18:02]That really feels like a completely new world.
[18:07]Because I mean, how many male athletes did we
[18:10]look up to as little girls, right?
[18:12]I had like a secret sort of girl crush on Chrissy Evert.
[18:16]I have to say, you know, the town.
[18:18]And everybody else, I feel like, is a blur of men.
[18:21]But she was my childhood hero.
[18:23]Yeah, I mean, we also have, you know, female athletes
[18:26]that we looked up to.
[18:28]But I think women are often asked to empathize with or see
[18:32]themselves in men.
[18:33]And I think a world would be wonderful.
[18:36]I don't mind that.
[18:37]I think it just also should be that young boys
[18:40]see idols in women too, that they don't just
[18:43]have to have to look at greatness in male form.
[18:48]100% totally great.
[18:49]And speaking of idols, tell me a little bit about Natalie's
[18:52]book club and the books that you've been picking
[18:54]and how that's been going and all the rest.
[18:57]It's been so fun to get to share and hear
[19:01]people's opinions about books.
[19:03]And yeah, and it's brought me to so many interesting corners.
[19:08]I'm kind of an eclectic reader.
[19:09]So, you know, I'm not, I don't have like a genre that people
[19:14]can like, you know, rely upon.
[19:16]So I hope that is okay for people following.
[19:19]Because sometimes it's fiction.
[19:20]Sometimes it's not fiction.
[19:21]Sometimes it's, you know, poetry or, and it's been really
[19:26]interesting to get to talk to all these different writers
[19:30]and understand more about their processes.
[19:33]And of course, read some great books along the way.
[19:35]Are you reading anything great now?
[19:37]I think, amazing by your bedside.
[19:39]I've finally read Untamed, which had, I know, I'm so late
[19:43]to the game, so you only have wonderful, it was.
[19:46]And they were all right.
[19:48]Like, it's so rare when something glitz up to the hype.
[19:51]And it really, it really did.
[19:53]I really loved the book club books that I've,
[19:55]I really like have stuck with me in such a deep way.
[19:58]I would say the last book.
[20:00]Children Archives, the Valeria Luis LA book is amazing.
[20:04]Like that's like really, really effective,
[20:07]maybe go a woman other, was incredible.
[20:11]A new Eleanor Frondie, and then picking out all fiction books.
[20:15]But then some surprises too, like the Rob and Walk camera
[20:18]or book gathering loss was like, I was wrapped.
[20:22]It was so incredible.
[20:24]And Patrice Keller's memoir is,
[20:28]and they call you a terrorist, is really, really moving.
[20:32]And world changing, like,
[20:34]shit completely changes the way you see the world
[20:37]through one person's story.
[20:39]It's really a wonderful book.
[20:41]Yeah, I mean, so many.
[20:42]Everyone has an incredible adventure.
[20:45]I have a whole new stack of books now.
[20:47]I have to like make any little shelf here for you.
[20:49]Yeah.
[20:50]What are you reading?
[20:51]I recently read The Vanishing Half by Britt Bennett,
[20:53]which like untamed, like everybody had already read.
[20:56]And I was so late to it.
[20:58]And I was like, almost didn't want to read it
[21:00]because it had, I'm like, you can't possibly be this good.
[21:03]And then it was.
[21:04]I was like, how great is that?
[21:05]So, but yeah, lots of, I don't even know,
[21:08]lots of different books.
[21:10]I'm reading a new book coming out called The Push
[21:12]by Ashley Audrain about a mother
[21:14]who's sort of in a victim of abuse,
[21:16]sort of through the generations,
[21:18]right, like her mother, grandmother,
[21:19]and how she mothers, but it's like a thriller.
[21:22]I don't know, it's kind of, it's really good.
[21:23]That's what I'm reading right now.
[21:24]And you know, fables, right?
[21:26]So.
[21:27]Yes, I know, I'm constantly reading a whole variety
[21:31]of children's books.
[21:32]Yes, we just finished Lady pancake and Sir French toast.
[21:34]It's that's really what I was reading.
[21:36]That's a really good one.
[21:37]Really good one.
[21:38]That one.
[21:39]Yeah, that's perfect.
[21:40]That's good.
[21:41]So do you have any advice?
[21:42]I would say both to aspiring authors
[21:45]and especially children's authors,
[21:47]but also just people who want to emulate your activism
[21:51]and how to make a difference in terms of advocating
[21:53]for women, especially in getting equal footing.
[21:56]So for books, I mean, I think it's really,
[21:59]for kids' books, you just have to imagine
[22:02]and maybe practice with kids,
[22:05]what keeps their attention?
[22:06]I know I need to mention like farts and fur
[22:10]and, you know, like, boogers, like,
[22:12]anything that's what keeps my children attention?
[22:16]You know, to, I don't know, not that you have to do that,
[22:20]but I think that the silliness always helped
[22:23]with the kids' books and practicing on them,
[22:25]like, I definitely read them in the book so many times
[22:28]to find what the, you know,
[22:31]what the farts I needed to change,
[22:33]what they understood, et cetera.
[22:35]In terms of activism and I feel like what I've learned
[22:39]the most is to listen to the people
[22:42]who've been doing their work and follow them
[22:44]and like, not trying to invent anything yourself.
[22:49]Like, find the people who are,
[22:52]because there are a lot of people who are doing it
[22:55]really well, not to put anyone down.
[22:58]Like, obviously, if you want to devote your life to it
[23:01]and go do it, but the thing I think is like,
[23:04]when you're new to it, the best thing to do
[23:07]is find the people who've been doing it for decades,
[23:10]who've been organizing, who've been leading,
[23:12]and then listen to what they say and go with them.
[23:16]I mean, when you believe in their,
[23:18]in what they're doing and their actions,
[23:20]but that's been, I learned the most.
[23:24]Yeah, by listening, I guess that's always true.
[23:27]Can I ask one last perhaps inappropriate question?
[23:29]How do you stay looking so young?
[23:32]Like, you do not age.
[23:33]And I'm just like looking at your skin.
[23:38]This is like so creepy to me, but I'm just like,
[23:40]oh no, I am not doing it.
[23:43]All I do is go like, look at all these,
[23:45]like, I have like lines everywhere, every day, new ones.
[23:49]But you know, I'm like trying to just embrace it.
[23:52]I'm like, I feel like I earned it.
[23:54]Like, I don't know, my best friend
[23:57]did ever like talking last night
[24:00]from both turning 40 this year.
[24:01]And she was like, ah, 40.
[24:03]And I was like, no, 40, that's like a,
[24:06]that's like an achievement.
[24:07]Like, you know how many people don't get to reach this?
[24:10]Like, how lucky are we and how cool is this?
[24:12]And look what we did to get here.
[24:14]And like, this is amazing.
[24:16]And you know, it's, I don't know.
[24:19]I feel like, you know, I don't want to look inexperienced.
[24:24]I'm not inexperienced.
[24:26]I'm full of experience, I am full of,
[24:29]I am full of joy and wisdom and curiosity.
[24:33]And if that's what, you know, my lines represent
[24:36]than like, great.
[24:38]That's, that'd be a signal, awesome.
[24:41]I don't know.
[24:42]I think, yeah, looking young is overrated.
[24:46]Thank you.
[24:47]I wasn't just what I needed to hear tonight.
[24:49]So thank you for that.
[24:50]Yes.
[24:51]Looking young is overrated, wasted on the end.
[24:54]Yeah, forget it.
[24:55]No, let them enjoy it.
[24:56]That's the best part about being young.
[24:58]You don't know anything at that point.
[24:59]So like, I don't know, being young was like so painful for me.
[25:04]Like, feel like it's such like a painful,
[25:06]not knowing, searching, figuring it out,
[25:09]feeling uncomfortable on my own skin time.
[25:12]Like, give them this clear skin.
[25:15]That's true.
[25:17]It can happen.
[25:19]The bonus prize for happening to build a fight through.
[25:22]Yes, all of them.
[25:23]No clue what's coming next.
[25:25]Yeah.
[25:26]Nothing being settled at all.
[25:28]And every day is a question mark.
[25:30]Now we have everything settled.
[25:32]And here, I have the lines.
[25:33]So fine.
[25:34]Or for me.
[25:35]Anyway, awesome.
[25:36]Well, Natalie, thank you so much.
[25:37]Thanks for all your time.
[25:38]And I really appreciate it.
[25:40]That was really fun.
[25:41]So thank you, you too.
[25:43]And be well.
[25:44]I hope everything.
[25:47]Yeah.
[25:47]Thank you.
[25:48]Stay safe.
[25:49]Yeah.
[25:49]All right.
[25:50]Bye-bye.
[25:52]Thanks so much to beekeepers' naturals
[25:54]for helping me through a sick day with the amazing cough syrup
[25:58]and cough spray, throat spray that you have,
[26:01]and thanks for helping all my listeners.
[26:03]Beekeepersnaturals.com slash no time promo code no time.
[26:08]Thanks for listening to this episode of Moms Don't
[26:10]Have Time to Read Books.
[26:11]Don't forget to follow me on Instagram at zebi Owens
[26:14]and at Moms Don't Have Time to Read Books.
[26:16]Also sign up for my newsletter at zebiowans.com
[26:19]and sign up for my virtual book club
[26:21]and meet lots of authors on Zoom every other week.
[26:23]Thanks so much to Steve and Ryan at Texture Sound
[26:26]for the Sound Editing.
[26:27]And thank you to Morning Moon Productions
[26:29]for providing this fantastic intro and now trim music.