Gina Hamadey, I WANT TO THANK YOU: How a Year of Gratitude Can Bring Joy and Meaning in a Disconnected World

[0:02]Zibby Owens: This is Zippy Owens, and you're listening to the award winning podcast, Moms Don't Have Time to Read Books. I'm also the host of Moms Don't Have Time to Lose Weight, and I'm the editor of the anthology, which you should run out and buy, called Moms Don't Have Time to: Quarantine Anthology. All proceeds of that book go to COVID nineteen Vaccine Research. And I'm the editor in chief of Moms Don't Have Time To Write, a new publication on Medium, and we're accepting submissions, so please send your personal essays there. If all that isn't enough, you can follow me on Instagram at Owens, and my website is zibbyowens.com. Okay. Now back to this amazing podcast. Listeners, if you enjoy this podcast, I promise you will love my new audiobook for moms don't have time to a quarantine anthology. It's not about the quarantine, but a lot of the essays were written during that time about other things that moms don't have time to do or other busy people, things like reading, eating, working out, breathing, having sex. And 60 bestselling and notable authors wrote essays. All those authors have been on this very podcast. So if you like to listen to my conversations, if you want to get to know these authors better, I read the audiobook myself. Check it out on Audible, Moms Don't Have Time to A Quarantine Anthology. Again, Audible audiobook. Go listen to it. It's like sixty minutei podcasts. I hope you enjoy. Gina Hamadeh Bergman is the author of I Want to Thank You: How a Year of Gratitude Can Bring Joy and Meaning in a Disconnected World. She was the travel editor at Food and Wine and Rachael Ray Everyday and started her career at the groundbreaking titles, Oh, the Oprah Magazine and George. She founded the content and social strategy firm Penknife Media, and has written for publications such as the New York Times, Real Simple and Elle. She currently lives in New York. Welcome, Gina. Thank you so much for coming on moms don't have time to read books to discuss. Wanna thank you how a year of gratitude can bring joy and meaning in a disconnected world. To be I truly could not be more thrilled to be here. Oh, your book was so great, and I literally was, like, completely inspired to try this project myself. And then, of course, I've done nothing about it. Tell listeners what your book is about and the project that inspired the writing of it.

[2:10]Gina Hamadey: Sure. So I went on a little gratitude journey in what I called my thank you year, where I wrote three sixty five gratitude notes, gratitude letters, thank you notes, whatever you wanna call them. And I structured it like so. Every month I turned to a different group of recipients. So there were neighbors, there were friends, family members, mentors, healthcare workers, and then some more conceptual

[2:37]Zibby Owens: topics like food and travel. And in the book, you talked about your train ride where you came up with this idea. Tell me that story again.

[2:46]Gina Hamadey: Okay. So I was doing this reverse commute from Brooklyn to Summit, New Jersey for a time to Bowen Branch where I was consulting at the home goods company. Summit, New Jersey is a very sweet little town. And this was in January 2018, and it was coming off the heels of, as you know, every holiday season is a busy holiday season. I don't know. This one felt particularly busy and I just didn't enjoy it. And so an hour on a quiet train ride to New Jersey felt like literal heaven. And I was spending it kind of caught up in my to do list and emails and feeds until I turned to a stack of thank you notes that I had promised to donors of a fundraiser to City Harvest, a City Harvest fundraiser. And this wasn't a task that I was I don't know. I think I felt neutral about it. I wasn't looking for I I wasn't one of those people that as a thank you note person, which now I'm meeting them. You know, they are, like, around and they are super psyched to write thank you notes. That was not me. It wasn't something I was dreading either necessarily, but I felt neutral about it. But the act of sitting down in a quiet train ride with a stack of thank you notes and writing something positive, thank you for giving money to this, you know, organization that I believe in, it just felt like a blanket of calm and relaxation and focus that my brain really needed without me ever anticipating that. I sort of backed into it where I felt like, Why does this feel so good? What is happening? And I noticed that the mood would carry on into my day. Like, I felt like I had a little, like a veil was lifted. I had a little, I don't wanna say too many cliches all the row, but it was basically like I just felt like the day started off in a much better clear eyed way. And I was thinking about all this on January 31 because I just finished the last thank you note. And I looked at my list and there were 31 thank you notes that I had written and it was January 31. So I thought it kind of The whole concept came to me fully formed. I've written a thank you note for every day this year. It was a surprisingly positive experience. Maybe this is my this is my project this year. And then because I came up in magazines, I kind of wrote a little content calendar for it. I love it. It's just such a clever idea. And I love that you started with your community

[5:14]Zibby Owens: and even like books are magic and that you the guy at like the the butcher shop or whatever it was who kept your letter. And I love that the way you approached it was like, I'm gonna do this and we'll see what comes of it. Right? Like, didn't know. You didn't have like a mission. Maybe it'll be good. Maybe it'll help the other people too. Who knows? And then you got so much positive feedback. People value these so much. And I know for me, like a handwritten note and I, you know, especially like if somebody passes away or something, those are the first things I go to. I need to like see what I have. I do like my inventory. And any note is so, it has so much more value because all these other emails, they just, even if they're super nice, they just get lost, right? Nobody's like framing an email or something. Right? Right. It's transient. So I just love this sort of like retro, but so important, like to make this lost art of writing so important, I say is like, I literally this morning was like trying to get my kids to write thank you notes for their birthday. I'm like, Thank you notes, thank you notes. They're like, Ugh, why do we have to do this? I'm like, I don't know, you just do.

[6:17]Gina Hamadey: Well, I have some tips for them to make them a little more fun. That was one of my months where I was writing with my son at the time he was five. We were writing thank you notes after his birthday, and I too was like, Oh great, this will just cross off this month really super quickly. But I stalled on those because those are really boring to write. It's really fun actually to write to a neighbor who's a treasured friend or a mentor. Those are actually really fun things to write to because you probably have something to say to that person that maybe you've never said, and it's just an actual fun thing to do. But writing and saying, Thank you for the LEGO set, it's just so boring. It just feels like there's always something you'd rather do. So in that case, we kind of went a little deeper and I asked my son to say something that he likes about each of those kids. Anyway, just makes it a little more fun. So I would say if there's if you could just go one step, like one sentence, one step deeper than thank you for the LEGO set, and it's like just one little thing, you know, makes it more fun. So true.

[7:23]Zibby Owens: The whole premise too of just reconnecting with people and sort of deepening the connections you have is so important and friendship in general. I just wanted to read this one passage. And as I told you, I have, like, so many dog eared pages here because there is so much good stuff. And excuse me for my cold here. But you said, so as I sent the cards off to houses I've never seen in California and Seattle and Chicago, I thought about how keeping old friendships alive took time and that time was something we once had but no longer do. When time becomes scarce, why is friendship the first thing to be sacrificed? Maybe it explains social media's rocketing rise. We are all craving the friendships we had when we were younger, and we settle for this faux virgin because it's all we think we have time for. This month's correspondence took a little effort and time to be sure, but it meant more than a social media smiley face, and it was more efficient than scheduling 26 catch up phone calls. So tell me me about this and how you had been fitting friendship into your life and how you think about it now post project.

[8:21]Gina Hamadey: The friend month so each because each month's topic was so different, they each form was really different. So the Friends Month was a good example where it kind of took me a week or so to figure out how I was gonna do it because my neighbor's month, the prior one, was easy. It was like, okay, I'll find neighbors, stores and people who live near me who have done some really nice favors at some point and I'll write them a little thank you note about it. But then when I tried to apply that to friends, it just didn't make sense. Thank you for inviting me to your family trip thirty years ago. I mean, just felt and it felt wrong. That's not what friendship is about, is favors. So what I eventually did was find old photographs. I opened up my shoe boxes and I turned some of those old yellowing photographs into postcards. You just reinforce it with a four by six mailing label and that's it. It's a book card. It's easy. So that then became really fun because it's like the copy's already written. It's like each sentence I started pretty much the same, which was, Remember when we were young and carefree? Because almost all those pictures felt like that, where it was just us at a bar, us in Italy, we're laughing and reading ice cream. We're on a moped. And so it was that and then a little about, a little sentence about the memory that it brings up and a little wish for the future, hope to see you soon kind of thing. So it was actually very easy once It was a tiny bit of an art project, but it was actually Those went really fast. And then the reactions were so lovely and heartwarming. And it did underline something that I've always felt, which is just I born in California, had dear, dear friends who I'm still very close with. I went to school in Michigan. I've been in New York since 2001. It's so hard to keep up these friendships, but they are so important to me. They're more important to me than many other things that I do make time for. And it just feels like it actually doesn't take much to kind of keep it up. Not in the way that I wish we could, but that gesture felt like I sort of bought myself another five years. Not that I want to wait five years before being in touch with some of these people again, but it just expressed the effort that I took with it and the words that I wrote and the effort that it was clear that I made, it just reinforced the love that I have for them. I know it made people feel great, and I got a lot of comments like, This made my day, this made my week, Of course, I remember this. And it just felt like such a wonderful, positive, almost free thing to do. And it just reminded me of one of my my God, I was almost gonna use a I'll just use the marketing term. I know this is a marketing term, my core values. Yep. But it is one of my core values that these friendships are so important to me, and I don't wanna live my life pretending that they're not. But I don't have the time to sit down with all of them. I just don't. You know? So this was sort of like me making it work. It's so important. I mean, it's so true that you have to, like, at some point, put some time

[11:48]Zibby Owens: behind the things that matter. I mean, this sounds ridiculously obvious, but I feel like friendship, like you said in the book, and I think that's why I responded to it, like, you know, it'll be there. Right? But it doesn't mean you can like I have friends who I haven't talked to in forever and I call them it's like, oh, know, it's like we pick up where we were, but friendships do need tending to, right? Like a fire before they go out, right? You got to like, you know, tend to the embers a little or whatever. And something like this is so easy and sweet and thoughtful. But now I feel like it's less thoughtful because I didn't think of it myself because because it's your idea if I No. No. No. Myself.

[12:25]Gina Hamadey: Deal. No. Please. Are you kidding? Steal away. Steal away. The let me just for so you literally just took the picture and put on a mailing label. You don't have to laminate the front or anything with the actual picture. And I tried a few different things. Like, I did try, like, not laminating, but, like, I got little cellophane packages to stick in. I know that. And I took a few things to the mailing label. And this is just it's like comes in a round sticker thing. It's, you know, on Amazon or whatever. It's like four by six mailing labels. And it comes in a round thing and you take off one sticker and you literally and for me, I'm not a crafty person. Like it, there would always be like, it wasn't exactly even. And even though they're both four by six, it's like the label's a tiny bit longer. You kind of fold it over. It's like a little crude and it's not perfect and Pinterest y. I'm sure you could make it so if you wanted, it just wasn't the point for me. And that's it. You put it on and that's it. Then you write the little line, you draw the little line in the postcard and right.

[13:21]Zibby Owens: That's amazing. But aren't sad you don't have those pictures?

[13:25]Gina Hamadey: Well, you know, I don't know how you are. I'm not sure if we're the same age. I feel like I'm 41 and I just had so many of these. You can absolutely, A, something from your computer and get doubles or something. You can, I don't know, make a copy at the local whatever? I just feel like I had so many duplicates. It wasn't I just would rather and it's like they're all in this box that is, like, slowly yellowing. And I'm like, what am I I don't know. I just I felt okay giving them away.

[13:58]Zibby Owens: I'm 44, FYI. But I have them all in albums. I don't know if you can see it. Like, these are Yeah. I love it. Like, I have these and I'm pointing to I have, like, that whole row there. And then in the cabinets below, I have all the photo albums from, like, the nineties. And I mean, I I I was really good about putting them in albums, so I would have to, like Yeah. Pull them out. But I do I'm sure I have some floating away. Maybe you just take a picture of it or a screenshot or something. Well, yeah. I I took a picture of every note I ever wrote and including the front and back of these. And then I I made a little photo album of it just so I had, like, a record of the year. So, yeah, they're in there. Perfect. I love it. And how did it feel for you writing the book, like, as you were going through? Like, what was it like sort of documenting it and then writing it at the same time and making time not only for friendship and the notes, but then the book about the friendships and the notes and the responses and all of that? Tell me about that. So I finished the year

[14:54]Gina Hamadey: it was 2018, and I finished out the year. And toward the end, Cup of Joe, Jenny Rosenstrach from, you know, Dinner, A Love Story, etcetera, She wrote about it on Cup of Joe in October and I made a little Instagram. So I kind of Up until then, I really was privately doing this and really not talking about it with anybody aside from my husband. And then at the end of the year, I guess that was me going public with it. And I had been writing notes the whole time. I should say that because I'm a writer, so I was hoping I didn't know what it would be, but I wanted to keep track. So I was writing notes, but I only wrote a I started working on a book proposal in 2019. So once the year was done, I started working on a book proposal and shopped that around, wrote a revise, got my agent, sold it, and I got the deal in July 2019, and then I had eight months to write it. So the process of writing it I think the hardest part was, know, having all of this raw data of all the notes and knowing that they could be you know, like that could just go in so many ways. Is is it a memoir? Is it a how to? Is it you know, some people were like, just print all the notes. I'm like, that must must be so boring. Like, why would anybody wanna read these stuff? You know, there's just so many ways to slice it. And especially the big question is like, how personal should it be? How much will people care? You know, all of those things. So in the planning of it and in the writing the proposal and especially the second draft of the proposal from the first draft. And I don't I I only bring this up here because I know some I feel like this is a good place to talk about this. I feel like some of this is inside baseball for some of the press I'm doing, but I feel like this is a good Yeah. No. Tell me the whole the nuts about it. Yeah. So the first proposal was more was really kind of about my journey and just that kind of with some how to, was like a how to memoir. And then the second draft really brought in a lot of First of all, I made the structure of pulling out a lesson, a surprise, and a benefit for every chapter. One of the agents that rejected it, she was like the kindest rejection ever. And I took some of her advice literally, which is, I'm not sure that you could access some of these lessons and benefits. Like, I'm not sure that you'll be able to, I don't know, access them or something. I'm like, Oh, well, what if I just literally put them at the top for each chapter? And then those became a nice That was sort of a nice way to structure it because those became the subheads. Structurally I got more organized. And also I brought in every chapter, I pulled in an expert to kind of shed light on those benefits that I was personally feeling. But you know what, now it's like everything in retrospect to be old, obvious. It's funny. But it's like when the sky's the limit, it's like this path wasn't clear. So it took a while to sort of get that. And then once the proposal that I wrote was so detailed and I had all the experts, I had them all decided and I decided that I would sit down with my mother-in-law and I would sit down with my friend that was a street, that she and I were estranged and I knew that she would actually be generous enough to sit down with me and have an interview about why we were estranged and how to thank you know got us back in touch. So the proposal was so detailed that the actual writing of it in those eight months was a pleasure because every time I would open up a new chapter, felt like, okay, I have a little blueprint and I can change it a little bit, but at least I know what I'm writing. That's great. Benefit of good outlining. I feel so good.

[18:46]Zibby Owens: It's so true. I mean, the idea of writing a book feels like you know, it's like seeing an empty field and being like, let's build a house. Like, where would you even start? Right? Mhmm. But then if you then you have, like, some fabrics, like your notes or something. Or then, you know, then you bring bring in an architect and say, like, I don't know. What do you think? Or what style would you like? And I don't know. It's like the difference between sort of renovating and building a house from scratch. Like, for me, idea of building a house from scratch seems like so overwhelming I could never ever do it. But some people love that, right? I think it's like, you have to it's just sort of more psychologically how you approach the project. Right? Having this as like the baseline.

[19:23]Gina Hamadey: Never mind. I'm not making any sense. I hope you know what I'm saying. No, you are. No. But it's it's just it was just interesting. I have I've had a lot of people say, oh, well, is probably easy because you add all those notes. And I'm like, yeah, it was great to have all those notes to quote from, but that didn't give me any indication of like what this story is and what people would wanna hear and what's interesting and

[19:43]Zibby Owens: anyway. Well, I love how Emma Straub from Bookstore Magic said you were like the nicest person ever because I didn't doubt it as I read through the whole book and saw all the ways you just acknowledged people and stayed in the moment and just, like, saw the whole person and didn't let these things sort of wash over you. Like, I think this whole gratitude sort of movement, if you will, is it's really like the secret sauce of life. Right? Because if you don't stop and be grateful, that's it. The moment passes and, like, you don't get that extra jolt of, I don't know what it is, but satisfaction, emotion, all of the good stuff. So a book like yours just completely makes it something actionable and something you can accomplish. And it's just great. It's just great.

[20:31]Gina Hamadey: Thank you. Because you do need a little help, I think. Because it's one thing to say, I'm gonna be more grateful, but I do find that you need a little bit of help figuring out what that is. You know, I actually, I grew up with, my dad came from Ohio, very middle class. And then he was like self made, I don't know. He like did great in his life and he sort of was so obsessed with making sure that we were grateful all the time. And he was just so obsessed with it. And I feel like there were so many times when he would say like, Why aren't you looking at the sunset? Aren't you grateful? Like, why aren't you I don't know. And I remember thinking a lot as a kid about like, how does that work? Like, is me being grateful saying it out loud or is it thinking it? Or like, how does it work? Like, how would I even express to my dad that I am grateful? Do I just have to say it all the time? Or like, what is that? And I think that doesn't I think that the expressing it is really important because writing in a gratitude journal is very helpful. It's not for everybody. I feel like I've bought gratitude journals over the years and I'm like super into it for two weeks and then I drop it and it gets buried under novels on my nightstand. But there's something about expressing it, even though that takes a little bit of bravery because it's not something you have to do and therefore it feels awkward or I don't know. It's like there is something you have to get over in order to express something really totally open hearted and vulnerable and earnest. But once you do that, there's this feedback loop of you get it back and I don't know. I think that's the real difference. And you say, Oh, Emmett says you're nice. You obviously are nice. Look at this whole book. But this was me trying to do the thing that I Otherwise, if I didn't make this, I would be stuck in my to do list, in my feeds, in my head, you know? And so this was forcing myself to really see other people in my life and not just the ones that are obvious, but the ones that are in my life that really make it better. But it takes a little bit of structure in order to do that. But you don't have to write three sixty five notes to do that, is what I would say. Maybe ten, five? Maybe 10, maybe 10.

[23:02]Zibby Owens: Oh my gosh. I also think even if it's not a note, being able to when you're in those moments too, like that you would have so often with a neighbor or whatever, know, just saying like, just really highlighting the time, like, someone, you know, lets you go and if you don't have enough money for four but you can only buy two or something, happened to you. You know, this made my day. You know, I feel like I didn't used to be like that, and now I'll stop and say like, thank you so like, this totally made my day. Like, you made me so happy. Like, oh my gosh, you should feel good about, you know, something. Yeah. Mean, if you It makes a difference. It

[23:37]Gina Hamadey: makes a difference. It's how much more time does it take than just like, Oh, thanks. Just saying, like you said, like, No, you don't understand. Yeah. This really made my day. I mean, words like, this made my day is a phrase that I thought about so much throughout this year because it's probably what I heard the most. And it might be a cliche, but what a lovely cliche. Like, a lovely power to have to make somebody else's day. Know? 100%.

[24:02]Zibby Owens: I totally And I'm really quick to say when somebody makes my day. Like even like some sort of comment or something on Instagram or whatever, like sometimes like the notes are really nice and I'll like read it out loud to my husband and I'll be like, This made my day. Like, you know, I shared some private thing and like somebody it helps somebody out in the world who I don't even know. Like and then I'll just say like, Oh my gosh, you made my day. I read this to my husband. You know, I don't know. I mean, we might as well be open about stuff like we're pretty everybody's open about the negative stuff. Well, and it's like, as writers, that's

[24:35]Gina Hamadey: part of our motivation, right? It's like, you want to reach people, you wanna share your own experiences or your own, whatever it is you're sharing so that you reach people and you touch them in some way. But one of the points I was making is that you don't have to be a great writer and do that. Little notes are on a smaller scale. Everybody can do that. You don't have to be a writer. You can just write to people in your life, and you'll have that same power. Yes. I mean, chances are people won't even remember the content of your notes as much as the feeling they got from reading it. Exactly. Exactly.

[25:12]Zibby Owens: So, Gina, what is coming next for you? Do you have more books coming, or what's your are you done with thank you notes, or do you never wanna write another one the rest of your life? Or what how do you feel now?

[25:23]Gina Hamadey: You know, I am I'm figuring out what's next as far as projects. I always have a I have a, you know, I have a bunch of clients. I have a content agency thing. So I'm busy, but trying to figure out what's my next bigger project. I have a bunch of thank you notes that I have written but not addressed. I feel like I sort of get stuck in that where I have like I have like 20 thank you notes right now that I wrote to like, I don't know, the Today Show, you know, like my press people and people who host me at their bookstores and stuff. I'm just like, oh god, need to address them. So I I am still writing thank you notes, certainly not at a clip that I once was. But I don't know, this was something that I wanted to do my whole life and I'm trying to stay. I quote you a lot with your, I don't want to miss the plot. I loved that that you said that. And I'm right now just trying still. It's two months since the book published, and I'm like really still rooted and like really trying to enjoy it and not get caught up in all the nonsense. I don't know. There's so much nonsense you can get caught up in. But in the last couple weeks, I've been just popping into Barnes and Noble and signing them, and they're so nice about it. I sure how they would react, but they're like, oh my god, of course. Let me gather them and I'll put some little stickers on. And I don't know. I'm trying to like stay present and like not take it for granted that, you know, I'm like, I'm sure like you. Like, we're book nerds. Like, my whole life I wanted to write a book and that now I have a book out and I'm trying to live in that world

[27:01]Zibby Owens: still and then get to the next project when it comes. I love that. That's exactly right. Don't get caught up in the stuff. The you know, and, yeah, ignore all of the stuff.

[27:13]Gina Hamadey: I love that. But god. So much stuff. So much that you could, like, hang your mood on and it's like, why? Why? Totally, totally agree.

[27:21]Zibby Owens: Well, I really, really enjoyed your book and it's beautiful and I love the colors and even I know it's so superficial,

[27:29]Gina Hamadey: but I know I just even love how it looks. No. Thank you. They actually allowed me a lot of say in this and they were patient when I kept rejecting their first two rounds of covers, which I know is super rare. I'm very grateful to Tarture Perigee for that.

[27:44]Zibby Owens: It's awesome. Well, it turned out really great.

[27:47]Gina Hamadey: Amazing. Well, maybe you need to launch your own line of stationery or something. That would be pretty cool. That would be nice. Yeah. Who knows? That's one I know. Have like this whole lit I literally have a Google doc right now that says, this is like embarrassing, but the title of it is You're a published author, now what? And that's I love it.

[28:05]Zibby Owens: That's one of them is that like, should I make some current I don't know. Should I start speaking to school? I don't know. Like right now, I'm like just writing this list and figuring out what's next. I have a friend who started a stationery business. So if you ever want me to put you in touch, you could at least, like, explore it with her if you did, like, your own line or you, like, sold it as a little package. Because that would be really nice if you had, like, you know, for the holidays this year, like, a little cards on top with, like, a little bow, and you could sell it together on your website or something. I don't know. Okay. Thank you. Lots of things. Alright. Well, thank you, Tina. Thank you so much, and I really hope to meet you in person. Thank I'm sorry this wasn't in person, although I have a cold, it's probably better. Anyway.

[28:45]Gina Hamadey: Anytime. Congrats on your book and enjoy it. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Okay. Bye. Bye.

[28:52]Zibby Owens: Thanks for listening to this episode of Moms Don't Have Time to Read Books. Don't forget to follow me on Instagram at Zibby Owens and at moms don't have time to read books. Also, sign up for my newsletter at zibbyowens.com and sign up for my virtual book club and meet lots of authors on Zoom every other week. Thanks so much to Steve and Ryan at Texture Sound for the sound editing, and thank you to Morning Moon Productions for providing this fantastic intro and outro music.