Claire Nelson, THINGS I LEARNED FROM FALLING: A Memoir

[0:49]Zibby Owens: Hi. This is Zippy Owens and you're listening to the award winning podcast, Moms Don't Have Time to Read Books. I'm also the host of Moms Don't Have Time to Lose Weight, and I'm the editor of the anthology, which you should run out and buy, called Moms Don't Have Time to A Quarantine Anthology. All proceeds of that book go to COVID nineteen Vaccine Research. And I'm the editor in chief of Moms Don't Have Time to Write, a new publication on Medium, and we're accepting submissions, so please send your personal essays there. And if all that isn't enough, you can follow me on Instagram at Zibby Owens, and my website is zibbyowens.com. Okay. Now back to this amazing podcast. Claire Nelson is the author of Things I Learned From Falling, a Memoir. Claire is a New Zealand born writer who has spent more than a decade in London working in food and travel journalism, including more than five years at Jamie Oliver's Magazine. She has also written for Elle, Food and Travel, Trek and Mountain, Lodestars Anthology, and WestJet Canada. Things I Learned From Falling is her first book. She lives in Toronto. Welcome, Claire. Thank you so much for coming on Moms Don't Have Time to Read Books to discuss things I learned from falling, a memoir. Thank you so much for having me. Oh my gosh. Claire, I saw this book when I first, like, heard about it. I was like, I'm gonna love that book. I need to read this book right away. This is amazing. And it did not disappoint your I mean, first of all, your story is just so incredible. But the way you wrote about it and the lessons you got from it and how inspiring oh my gosh, I had like goosebumps. It was just awesome. So anyway, I'm so glad you wrote Thank you so much. Would you mind telling everybody who might not know what your story is all about, what happened, and then when you decided to even make this a book? Wow. Okay. So, well, I don't know where to begin, but the crux of the story is it's based around accident I had while hiking in Joshua Tree National Park in California.

[2:41]Claire Nelson: I had left London to go and travel and sort of find some balance in my life and being alone in the outdoors. Had a fall, had an accident, and was left seriously injured in the desert for four days and three nights. And kind of trying to come to terms with the fact that I might not come out alive. And through that, then really looking at my life and getting a lot of that clarity that I'd gone looking for in a very fast track kind of a way.

[3:12]Zibby Owens: Yeah, this is not exactly what you meant by finding yourself. No. No. Wow. Well, first of all, your sort of physical endurance is really out of this world. I mean, I know that there were times in the book where you were like, you know, pain or death, pain or death. But still, to endure so much physical pain and come out the other side was, I mean, I don't even know how you did that. It's amazing.

[3:37]Claire Nelson: I mean, I think that we are so much stronger than we think we are. And the good thing is that we don't have to usually put that to the test. In our day to day lives, we're not having to really push the boundaries on our own capacity to stay alive, which is good. But I think if you are in those situations, I think anyone would surprise themselves about

[3:59]Zibby Owens: what they actually can endure and how strong they are. And just before I go into things that happened, like, can I get the PS, like what happens after the book? So is your are you totally fine in terms of I mean, I know obviously you were out hiking and everything, but are you okay? Do you have lingering side effects physically from what happened? Or tell me what life is like here? Yeah, I mean, I should preface this by saying it's small potatoes. So, you know, it's not like I'm like, Oh, this is really bad. But I still have physical pain. I

[4:29]Claire Nelson: have sort of permanent chronic arthritis in my ankle, which I'm currently about to start some physio on, which I wasn't able to do through the pandemic. And I get nibbling pains in that side of my body. I think just the last three years, have sort of everything's kind of a little bit out of alignment. So I'm just really having to focus on really looking after myself physically, which is no bad thing. But like I say, it's really not I almost appreciate the amount of kind of I've got because it's just enough to remind me how lucky I am, but not enough to stop me from doing the things that I love. All right. That's a very healthy outlook towards that. And I feel like I would just be whining, but okay.

[5:13]Zibby Owens: I'll take it. You know, one of the conclusions I feel that you reached in this book or in your life, I guess I should say, when you're sort of like, wow, fear really does stop us a lot, doesn't it? And you had like one line, and I, of course, won't be able to find it, but it's something where you're like almost talking to the reader and just like, yeah, look at that. Fear does really hold us back, doesn't it? Tell me about that.

[5:36]Claire Nelson: Yeah. It's like fear is such a waste of time when you really look at it. I mean, looking at my own life, the things that I was kind of, you know, when you're inevitably facing death and you have that, you know, moment of retrospection on how you were living your life before, and did I do it right? Do I have any regrets? The things that I was like, oh, I can't believe that was how I was living my life. All of the little bits and pieces, the anxiety and the imposter syndrome and the kind of not really putting myself out there, all of that stuff, it's all fear based. And I was like, but why is it there? Because this is fear that I have invented. And it just felt like, oh my gosh, like when I saw it, and I really looked at it from through that lens, it was like, wow, like, oh my gosh, what a waste of time. And I really wish I had had a chance to kind of step over that and just get on with it. Not knowing, of course, that I would have had a chance.

[6:32]Zibby Owens: And you also talked about the importance of connection and how even when your camera stopped working, that that was a loss for you because it was your connection with the outside world in some way even imagined and how you related more to the Tom Hanks volleyball situation.

[6:49]Claire Nelson: It's my Wilson. Yeah. You're Wilson. Exactly. Oh, here he is. It's my Wilson. Oh my gosh. The same camera. Still have it. Yeah, still use it. Still works. But, you know, yeah, that whole thing of I mean, there's also like an allegory there too, which I've really only understood and sort of looking back that I felt connected because I still had a digital device, even though it wasn't connected to anything. There is still that habitual reliance now, if I've got a digital device, I am somehow connected to people. And so I've been doing a lot of thinking and processing about that and what that means. But yeah, I'm a very solitary person. And I'm really, again, something else I've been looking at and processing is why am I such a solitary person? And where is that balance of getting just enough solitude versus really, am I just using it to kind of keep myself at arm's length from other people and really connecting and really allowing everyone, like people to see me, like warts and all. And that really just comes down to self acceptance. So yeah, it's like you start to unpick these things, and the whole thing unravels. Oh my gosh. What do you think, like, how has the impact of

[8:02]Zibby Owens: the fact that it's also public been on you? I mean, I know you talked about how newspapers picked it up right away and, you know, they were so, you know, not attracted. But everybody was writing about sort of the drinking of urine part of the situation. Yeah. Like Oh, they loved that. I mean, come on. I mean, that was like one tiny thing. Like, oh my gosh, they should have been talking about the fact that if you moved your anytime you went to the side, you were like blacking out with pain almost.

[8:29]Claire Nelson: Yeah. Doesn't

[8:31]Zibby Owens: make as good a head when Yeah. A woman drinks bone I mean, to be honest, what they should have done is really marketed the heck out of all those walking sticks. I feel like this is like ode to the walking stick. Not that I ever really hike because I'm so scared in general, but if I ever do, I'm getting a walking stick like yours just to be like, never know. I mean, oh my gosh. You never know. Be prepared. Might still have it. Like Kitty is out. Oh,

[8:55]Claire Nelson: I do. Yeah. In fact, I should have it's over the other side of the room. But yes, I have it. It's like I a magic

[9:03]Zibby Owens: know. You called it a magic wand. Wow. Yeah. So how has the sort of media attention on this affected your life? Because that's another way where you've suddenly had to become this like public person and people's fascination in your daily life. What was that like and how is it now?

[9:22]Claire Nelson: You know, there's the media interest before there was a book, when it was a news story. And that was a trip. I mean, it was weird because I was trying to come to terms with what had happened. And then at the same time, my life was just sort of, there was all interest. I mean, I ended up sitting on a couch with Al Rocco in New York, and I was like, what is going on? Also, I was like, well, this is a chance for me to help keep other people safe when they're hiking. And so that was great. But yeah, it was a lot to process. There's a lot there too, where for instance, there's some videos that I took that I shared with a news documentary in New Zealand, thinking that would be it. And of course, it ended up on an Australian version, and then it ended up on YouTube. And so now it's people have seen it. And so it's kind of, yeah, just getting used to the fact that people are then going to, they're going to project their own stuff onto your fifteen minutes of your experience and decide all the stuff. And it's kind of very amusing to me. It doesn't bother me, I just find it very fascinating. And then since the book, it's caused that's allowed me to tell my story in a very honest way. And there's stuff in the book there that people closest to me didn't know about or hadn't really understood. So it was really my way of being like, look, here it is. This is all of it and not holding back, which has been that's been great because it's really allowed me to feel more seen and to

[10:55]Zibby Owens: strengthen the connections in my life that I already had. And what was was it super emotional writing it? Like what was that like for you? You know, the

[11:04]Claire Nelson: parts in the desert were easy to write because they were so clear in my memory. And I really wanted to kind of preserve them. The parts of- all the other parts of my life, it was like my shadow life, all that stuff that I'd worked so hard to hide from other people I was now putting to paper. And yeah, that was hard. I mean, yeah, it was more just- I wouldn't say it was emotional so much as it was just uncomfortable. It was like, okay. But at the same time, once I'd written it, once it was out there, a relief because I didn't have to hide this stuff anymore. Today's episode is sponsored by Quince.

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[14:23]Zibby Owens: And meanwhile, it's not like you're a secret axe murderer or something. Do you know I mean? Mean? You know The things you are most worried about, which I totally relate to, right? Because they're your issues, right? And so they become so magnified, right, and embarrassing for you. Whereas the reader or the average person could read and be like, okay, yeah, I get that, right? Yeah.

[14:46]Claire Nelson: I know. This is the thing about- it's all to do with shame, right? So, the things that become ashamed of about yourself or about what you're feeling, and you hide it and you hide it. And so, it becomes like this cabin of shame. And then you open that box, and you let the light in, and it's no longer as big a deal. But what's been really, really amazing is when people have been contacting me and just being like, I so related to that. And oh, it's so nice to read someone else going through that. And they're like, oh, we're all the same. You know, we'll we'll get our stuff and it's nice. You know, when we start talking about it, it just makes it less scary and less shameful. It's so true. And that's so important. I mean, a lot of what you learned is not I mean, it's all

[15:26]Zibby Owens: you might have learned it anyway in your life, right, by just like age and wisdom and, you know, getting over some of the things and deeper connections and this and that to get you out of like the bubble. But because this was so dramatic, you know, I liked how you showed us who you know, the before image of you versus like, you have to do it. You had to show us, like, where you came and where you ended up and all of that. Yeah, I it helped to

[15:52]Claire Nelson: kind of explain a lot of what I was feeling when I was out there and also some of the decisions that I had made. It kind of needed that context. But of course, the lessons would have made no sense without knowing where I'd been before.

[16:05]Zibby Owens: That was crucial. And I love how right when you were rescued, and I hope it's not like giving anything away because obviously you were rescued because here we are. Spoiler alert. Spoiler alert. I know. Because there were times in here I was like, No, no, no, I'm reading this book, so it's going to be okay. But that you could be so sort of sarcastic and funny, like, right at the moment and how everybody was so surprised as you were, like, making jokes to the doctors or the nurses and all this stuff. Like, tell me about that moment. You were just so excited to be alive. Tell me about that. I mean,

[16:39]Claire Nelson: my default is humor. It's how I was brought up. It's just part of my personality. And that was the best day of my life. I was never going to be that ecstatic. So it was kind of like, first of all, I think the joking thing was just kind of like taking the edge off of the fact that this was a really major situation. But I was just deliriously happy. And I can't even describe the euphoria that I felt that day and then for a long time afterwards. Just, yeah, it was great to be able to just to be kind of jovial in those moments. Wow. I know. But also, it makes me sound a bit mad. No, not at all. It's great. It's great. No,

[17:17]Zibby Owens: because it was obviously such a contrast to when we got glimpses of what you were thinking during that time, especially all of the, you know, I'm not ready, I'm not ready. Like, this is not like, you don't usually you were like, I'm going to die here and I'm watch it happen slowly. And this is terrible. And this is not how I want it to end. Do you still flashback to those times? I mean, I know you had said you would have flashbacks to the whole thing or you did at least soon afterwards. But like that moment, like does that inspire what you do now?

[17:50]Claire Nelson: Yes, it does in its own way. I mean, what I remember most was that sense of that finally, that sense of acceptance, that really, that incredible feeling of being at peace with the situation. And I'm able to call on that because of course, like, I mean, I'm still human and I'm still going to get stressed and anxious and annoyed by trivial stuff. But I've just been called on that and remember that I got to have that moment of peace and then still come through and be alive and feel all this other stuff now. And yeah, it's always,

[18:24]Zibby Owens: always going to be there. And it's always going to be the thing that I can refer to. I feel like, and I was just mentioning this to a girlfriend of mine because I think about dying constantly. Like every morning I wake up and I'm like, okay, you know, I hope I don't die today because I have a lot to do. And like, you know, I'm taking this flight and oh my gosh, I hope I don't die on this flight because like I really need to get back and, you know? So it is like top of mind for me all the time. And in that way, I feel like I'm always fighting against time. I mean, I know my brand is like, funny, moms don't have time, whatever. But it's also that undercurrent that like none of us have time. Like our time is all limited. And what do you do knowing that? And I think some people operate life sort of with that in the forefront. And then my girlfriend who I was talking to was like, I never think that way. Like, what? And she's like, That never, it never occurs to me. And I was like, Oh no, it

[19:15]Claire Nelson: occurs to me all the time. So I'm feeling like, and this is obviously a leap, but like, this has to be at the front of your consciousness having come so close that it could happen again, right? Yeah. I mean, it's so funny. Just yesterday, was having a conversation with someone about death. And they were saying, you know, you must have this conversation a lot. It's like, well, I mean, I like having this conversation. I think, you know, it's the more you're aware of our mortality, it's weird to me that it's the one thing we can be certain of, it's the one thing that should inspire what we do each day. And yet no one wants to think about it. They don't want to talk about it. They want to pretend that it's just not an issue, it's just not a reality. And I'm like, that seems strange to me. Because that could do so much for us. And it's not about being morbid. It's not like, oh, we're all going to die. But we are. And hey, how about using that? I like that you're using that to be like, okay, time is precious. Yeah, let's go. Let's do this. Yeah, let's go. And I think I'm the same. It's like, for me, with my experience, it's like, well, this sucks. Whatever's happened is this sucks, but I could be dead. Or, hey, how lucky that I get to be ticked off at this thing today because I could be dead. You can use it in so many ways. But I think it's powerful. Think we should be using it and being more aware of it. And again, it's bit like shame. You let the light and it becomes less of a scary thing. Yes.

[20:39]Zibby Owens: Not to say and I think this comes probably from a place of anxiety, right? Because anyone with enough anxiety is always worrying about the worst thing. Like, thinking that if you worry about it enough when it happens, it won't be a big deal. But there you were and you had all this anxiety and whatever, and you didn't seem any more excited about the prospect of dying either. You know what mean? So I'm not sure it actually works right, as a tool. Yeah. You shouldn't be excited about it, but it's just being like, okay, well, this is a reality.

[21:08]Claire Nelson: And why don't I use that? Like, again, it's a health thing of It's almost like it takes away fear. If you really acknowledge mortality, it can really help you to just be like, well, and the fear doesn't matter because I'm going to die one day. So I might as well just do the thing. Again, it's just using it for good and not using it as something to worry about. Because again, that's you can't do it. You can't affect the outcome through worrying.

[21:31]Zibby Owens: And I saw on your blog and everything, so you ended up moving to Canada. Is that right? So now you're there or yes? Was that No, I'm in London again. So

[21:41]Claire Nelson: I had a two year visa for Canada. The first year was obviously turned upside down by this accident. So then by the time I was back on my feet, I had a year left on the visa. And I was like, well, I want to use that. So I moved to Vancouver. And that's where I wrote the book. But then my visa ran out. So I came back to London about three weeks before the pandemic hit. So yeah, it's been a time for Wow.

[22:05]Zibby Owens: All of How was that for like, what how did you end up getting through that? Like, what was your what was the two sentence experience like for you?

[22:17]Claire Nelson: A lot of watching birds and walking in parks. I was actually grateful for some of the lessons I had taken from the whole desert experience, because I think that some of that really came into play during all of this, and not just for me, for the people around me. I was actually grateful to be armed with those experiences.

[22:36]Zibby Owens: Particularly how you remembered sort of how to be bored, which I think was also a really powerful lesson.

[22:44]Claire Nelson: Yeah. Learning how to be bored, which is really just a way of learning to be comfortable, being very present and not looking to be distracted. And boy, there was moments of being tested through 2020. And also the whole trying to come off social media more. And that was, I mean, I gave myself a free pass during the pandemic for that because with exceptional circumstances. But yeah, that was a real

[23:11]Zibby Owens: new set of lessons and challenges for us. But I do love how you said that once you're bored, and I love that you said it made you read lots more books because I was like, well, there you go. There's one way you can, you know, but that you even noticed, I think you said something about like the squirrels or the movements of like the animals in the backyard and how that became like riveting TV essentially for you after a while and that you noticed all those little things happening and how great. I mean, especially as like a mom, everybody's always like, you know, let your kids be bored. And of course, they're like, no, I want more iPad. And, you know, the idea that even for adults, it's not so easy and it's important for us to be bored and not to be constantly overstimulating ourselves.

[23:54]Claire Nelson: It is. Exactly. And I think it's just slowing down is really what it is. And I still do it. I still, you know, anyone who follows my Instagram, I often post things of like the fox that hangs out in the garden or, you know, slow motion of a bee, because I'm just like staring at it. And I do use that. That's my meditation now, is to just really focus on nature and what's going on and just watching it, you pay attention to the details. And it just takes up all that noise and all that rush, rush, rush, and you can just slow it down. And yeah, I mean, kids, I think it's a great way to then become curious as well about the world that's around them, and as adults. And so now you've written this wonderful memoir,

[24:35]Zibby Owens: so inspiring in so many ways. What do you want to do with your life now? Like, what is your big game plan? Do you have one? Are you going to just like see what comes next? Like? Oh, Zippy, a game plan. Wow. No pressure. No pressure. Yeah.

[24:52]Claire Nelson: I mean, I'm really looking forward to traveling again. I want to keep writing and brainstorming some thoughts and ideas at the moment. It's really everything's just a short term plan now. You can't look too far ahead and just kind of, again, just slowing it down and and and going with what's going on in the moment. I love that. Everything is a short term plan.

[25:11]Zibby Owens: Right? I mean, because what else is there? I mean, of course they are, but, you know. Yeah. Wow. Okay. Well, what advice would you have for well, tell me, I want to hear a little bit more about the publishing journey of this book and then what advice you would have for people who are trying to become authors.

[25:27]Claire Nelson: Sure. So

[25:29]Zibby Owens: what does it look Okay, so you have all this media attention. At some point you decide you want it to be a book and that you're going to take the time and write it. How long did it take to write? Like, what was your process like? And then, you know, how involved was your editor? What was that whole experience like for you?

[25:46]Claire Nelson: Sure. Well, when I was still recovering in New Zealand, and I was writing this, and I thought, so many people were like, This should be a book. You should write a book. And it's something I've always wanted to do. So I thought, yeah, I can write this as a book. But in the back of my mind, I already had this idea for a book before this happened about addressing a lot of the stuff that, you know, in my life in London and all that anxiety and stuff like that. And I thought, there's so many parallels here between these two parts of my life. And so I remember thinking, would anyone care about that other stuff? And I approached a friend's friend put me in touch with her agent and the amazing Sarah Williams and said, I said to her, look, hi, this is the story idea I have. Do you think anyone would be interested? And she's just like, this is, you know, this is the story I've been looking for. Anyway, she really, really got what I was the story I was trying to tell. And it just kind of went from there. And by the time I was in Vancouver, I had a publisher, and then I had about three to four months to write it. So it was intense. Would spend my days, I was working part time in a shop, And then the rest of the time was just sitting in cafes and going to the Vancouver Public Library and just trying to get down. So many thoughts. And it's hard because writing a book is really daunting. I'm not trained to write a book. Don't have a wealth of academic experience. And like, this is how you write a book. Just had to kind of go with what felt right. I had the great editor at the publishers who was just helping me to pull the structure together. Yeah, sometimes I'm just like, Wow, that really happened. Wow,

[27:31]Zibby Owens: that's exciting though. Wow. Okay. And so what advice would you have for aspiring authors?

[27:36]Claire Nelson: Gosh, I think just write the way that you speak. I'm talking like for a memoir because I don't have experience in the rest of it. Write the way you speak. Write what feels right. Be prepared to have to leave parts of it out later on, but just still write everything down. And also read it out loud. Even if not too summer, but read it out loud and it really helps you to get the hang of the language and how things sound. It's actually not something I did enough of, I think. And I would sort of sometimes I'll read it out loud. I'm like, And also, finally, be prepared to the fact you probably never you're still always gonna wanna tinker with it until someone takes it away from you. Yes.

[28:13]Zibby Owens: Like a kid with their Legos. It's like, all right, no, it's time. Yes,

[28:18]Claire Nelson: exactly. It's time now. You're like, wait, wait.

[28:21]Zibby Owens: Wow. Well, Claire, thank you so much. What a great book. I'm so, again, inspired, I feel like a broken record. But you know, to have you go through this. And I feel like it's as if it happened to me. Do know what mean? Like, you're not trying to have us think that you're some superhuman person. You're trying to say you're just like everybody else with all your regular, you know, stresses and worries, and like, this is what happened. And I don't know. It's just so great. It's like the wake up call. I wish, I hope that it helps wake people up. Although anecdotally, I found like nothing except for the sort of experiences themselves kinda shake people up. But I'm hoping that your writing is enough to at least convert a few a few people to the, you know, seize the seize the day type of mentality.

[29:10]Claire Nelson: That would make me so happy. Even just one person, that would just make me so happy. Well, if any book can do it, it would be this one. There you go. Thank you so much. Alright. Well, I hope to meet you in person at some point. And Yes. Yeah. Well, anyway, thank you. This was really fun. Thanks so much, Zibby. Bye bye. Bye.

[29:27]Zibby Owens: Thanks for listening to this episode of Moms Don't Have Time to Read Books. Don't forget to follow me on Instagram at Zibby Owens and at moms don't have time to read books. Also sign up for my newsletter at zibbyowens.com and sign up for my virtual book club and meet lots of authors on Zoom every other week. Thanks so much to Steve and Ryan at Texture Sound for the sound editing, and thank you to Morning Moon Productions for providing this fantastic intro and outro music.