Jacqueline Friedland, HE GETS THAT FROM ME: A Novel
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[2:04]Jaclyn Friedland is the author of he gets that from me, a novel.
[2:07]Jaclyn is the author of the award-winning novels, Trouble the Water.
[2:10]And that's not a thing.
[2:11]She holds a BA from the University of Pennsylvania and a JD from NYU Law School.
[2:16]She practices an attorney in New York for a hot second before transitioning to writing full time.
[2:20]She lives in New York with her husband, four children, and two very bossy dogs.
[2:24]Welcome, Jackie.
[2:25]Thank you so much for coming on Moms.
[2:27]Don't have time to read books to discuss.
[2:29]He gets that from me.
[2:30]Hi, Sabie.
[2:31]Thank you so much for having me and for it to be here.
[2:33]It's so neat.
[2:34]I actually was talking to Kyle because I was reading your book and he was like,
[2:38]wait, I remember when we first met her and she was talking about how she was working on this book.
[2:43]And here it is.
[2:44]So I feel like some sort of investment that we've seen this, you know, come to fruition.
[2:49]So it's exciting.
[2:50]Sure, it is.
[2:51]It's a long process though.
[2:52]I actually just yesterday was a guest speaker for a high school literary club.
[2:57]And they were asking me about the process to publication.
[3:00]And they were all flabbergasted that they're like, wait, it takes that long.
[3:04]It takes that long to write a book.
[3:05]And then it's another year or two years before it comes out or three years.
[3:09]They couldn't digest this at all.
[3:11]But I told them it's good to be patient.
[3:13]It's a good lesson in patients putting hooks out into the world.
[3:16]Yes.
[3:17]Very, very true.
[3:18]Okay.
[3:19]Can you tell listeners what your book is about, please?
[3:22]Sure.
[3:23]It is the story of a young woman who serves as a surrogate mother only to discover 10 years after the fact that she accidentally gave away her own biological child.
[3:36]And how did you come up with this?
[3:39]So I was working on a different book.
[3:42]And I was in very beginning stages and I was procrastinating like you do.
[3:47]And reading, I don't even remember what publication I think it might have been people magazine online.
[3:52]And I saw an article about a woman who an American woman who served as a surrogate for a couple from China.
[3:59]And she was supposed to deliver twin babies.
[4:01]We're going to be the genetic offspring of this Chinese couple.
[4:04]And when the twins were born, one of the babies looked like the Chinese parents.
[4:09]And the other baby appeared to be black like the surrogate's husband.
[4:13]So, you know, all parties involved kind of scratched their heads, but still sent both babies home with this Chinese couple.
[4:21]And I guess, you know, over the next month, everybody kind of wise up to the fact that they should investigate.
[4:27]And it took them a month to figure it out and to figure out that the surrogate had actually gotten pregnant. She had been implanted with embryos and they thought that two had attached.
[4:38]But it turned out only one of the embryos took.
[4:40]And then when she was queer to have intercourse with her husband, she got pregnant again, you know, the natural way.
[4:47]And so the first thing I was like, wait.
[4:49]She was already pregnant. How'd she get pregnant again? Right. So, you know, immediately on Google and looking this up. And it turns out that this is actually something that happens. It's a thing that women who are pregnant can get pregnant again.
[5:01]It's just so incredibly rare that nobody ever tells you about it.
[5:05]It's called superfitation. And it's a real thing. And they actually think that a lot of fraternal twins may have been conceived this way.
[5:12]There's just not really a need to delve into the, you know, to do all that testing on the pregnant mothers to figure out if, you know, they might have a weak difference in their gestational age or, you know, what, but it explains a lot like why one twin is often much bigger than the other and things like that.
[5:29]And so I went on Google, found all this out. And then I was just so floored by the entire thing that I really just stayed on my mind. And I got to thinking, you know, what if the families have been the same race.
[5:40]And then they might not have realized, you know, that something was a miss. And what if it had been, you know, what if something happened 10 years later where they found out.
[5:48]And then what do you do when you discover you have a child that you have no idea was out there and do take it back. Do you not. And so immediately was I was like, I have to write this story.
[5:58]That's how the book came about.
[6:00]I love how that's how novelists think.
[6:03]All the what ifs instead of just saying like, okay, yeah, what if. And leaving it at that it's like, well, now I have to write a novel about it.
[6:11]You know, that novelists have their, they have more fear in general in life and anxiety because they go to every what if and they play out every possible scenario. So, you know, the minute you put me on an airplane,
[6:22]I'm a disaster because I imagine immediately all these terrible crazy things. And me too.
[6:28]I'm like, immediately like at my memorial service and like I'm on the whole route. Who would be left. How would they find out like blah blah. What if this plane. What if that plane. What if on the way back.
[6:38]What if it. Yeah. I'm like the queen. This I think is why I like love what I do because every day I talk to people who like share my anxiety and it's not amazing.
[6:49]And I'm like drafting my eulogy to send to my sister and like read this at my funeral, you know, sending it from the plane. Yeah, exactly. I know.
[6:57]Oh, should I book the place or should I give my list of spots and you know, I don't. Anyway. Yes. So the what ifs of the world. But yes. So I thought it was really interesting. The way this plot sort of evolved right and how it slowly manifested, especially from the point of view of a gay couple and how when they found out.
[7:18]When so for a lot of gay couples who have twins it's off in the case that one is from one one guys sperm and one is from the other and so they both feel like vested interest biologically in their kids.
[7:29]And so one of the ramifications of finding this out in your bike was that one dad ends up not having a biological child and the other dad does. And so he feels sort of alone in that grief because essentially he's just lost what he thought was like the continuation of his DNA and his offspring and all of that.
[7:48]So tell me a little bit about that piece of the puzzle. I found that really interesting.
[7:52]So, you know, I there were, first of all, when I was researching the book, I learned so much about third party assisted reproduction and all of the different ways that that couples and families can be built.
[8:04]And there's apparently, you know, if you have two women who want to be to want to raise children together oftentimes they will take the egg from one woman and fertilize it outside of the body and then implant it in the other woman.
[8:17]And so the other one carries pregnancy and then their people equally, you know, vested and they can both feel like the mother of this child.
[8:24]And there's so many different scenarios like that in different ways that families figure out to include different people and you know, have everyone be a part of it.
[8:32]And also, you know, there's adoption where nobody was involved in the pregnancy and it sort of it got me just to thinking, you know, we as parents project so much onto our children and believe so deeply that, you know, this trait they got for me, this one they got from their dad, this is from their grandmother and we think we know our kids so well.
[8:55]And you know, but then you think about like your own parents and how well they think they know you and how much you may think they're wrong.
[9:03]I really sort of wanted to play on the this idea that, you know, the kid, the nature versus nurture question may be different than anything that, you know, we've ever thought about and the way you build a family may be different than anything that we've ever thought about.
[9:20]And so when one dad has a son that he can say this child is biologically mine, he projects certain certain ideas onto that child and when the other dad finds out that neither child is biologically kids.
[9:34]He sort of has to question everything and really look into well what is it to be a father and what is it to have a child and how independent of me is my child or should he be.
[9:44]I really just wanted to play with all of those questions so that's kind of how it came about.
[9:50]And the impact between the siblings which becomes like a really big thing, you know, like how do they feel themselves right because all these fraternity and issues that.
[10:00]you always are thinking, go straight to the parents, right?
[10:03]But even at age 10, they have their own feelings.
[10:06]10 years is a long time.
[10:08]I mean, yes, yes.
[10:10]It actually, when I started drafting the book,
[10:13]my entire perspective was really about Kai,
[10:17]the boy who, you know, is genetically not related
[10:20]to the father that he thought he was.
[10:22]And I was looking at it from, you know,
[10:24]what his kindness, he has missed 10 years
[10:26]with his biological parents.
[10:28]He has missed 10 years with a biological sibling
[10:31]with his grandparents and all with his religion,
[10:34]with his, you know, all sorts of heritage.
[10:36]As I got deeper into the draft,
[10:38]I sort of realized, wait a minute,
[10:40]it's not only Kai has missed it,
[10:42]it's the parents and the grandparents and the siblings.
[10:44]And, you know, it's sort of like,
[10:47]and maybe Kai didn't, maybe Kai didn't miss anything
[10:49]because he got something else where everybody else,
[10:52]there's just sort of a hole where Kai should have been.
[10:55]So, you know, in that regard,
[10:58]I think also the sibling relationship
[11:00]was an interesting way to play with it
[11:02]because if you think about like some siblings
[11:04]get especially twins, you know,
[11:06]can really rely on each other, really get close
[11:08]and in a way that is very different
[11:11]from the parent child relationship.
[11:12]And so, you know, I think there's a loyalty
[11:15]that often exists between siblings
[11:17]that is really unique.
[11:20]And when somebody, sort of like attacks your relationship
[11:23]with your sibling, you almost get more protected
[11:25]than you ever would used to be like a parent relationship.
[11:27]So, for me, and also, you know,
[11:30]when you write a book, they tell you write what you know.
[11:33]And, you know, I've never had a child from surrogacy,
[11:36]but I know I have four kids in my own.
[11:38]So, parenting is something I know.
[11:40]And the idea of, you know,
[11:42]having my biological children in my house versus
[11:47]somewhere across the country
[11:48]where I never knew they were
[11:49]was something that I could really sort of imagine
[11:52]and play with.
[11:53]And I also had a sibling who, you know,
[11:55]a sister who's a couple years older,
[11:57]has been such a, you know, a force in my life.
[12:00]And so, I could play on that.
[12:01]And, you know, imagine what it would be
[12:03]if somebody told me, actually, you guys aren't related.
[12:06]And so, it was interesting actually
[12:08]as I've been getting reviews and feedback on the book.
[12:12]A lot of people have said, you know,
[12:13]as a gay dad, this book resonated with me,
[12:15]as a parent, this book resonated with me.
[12:18]Oh, and all sorts of things like that.
[12:19]But what really meant the most to me
[12:21]was one person contacted me through my website
[12:23]and told me that her daughter, who's in college,
[12:25]had the book and she's a twin.
[12:28]And that it really, she just was so struck by the book
[12:31]and, you know, the looking at the twin relationship
[12:34]and how important it is to twins,
[12:37]to have that relationship and that identity.
[12:39]And then when you sort of not attack it,
[12:41]it becomes how heart-wrenching it is.
[12:44]So that was a very interesting facet of the book for me.
[12:47]Well, I have twins.
[12:49]I don't know how they would feel.
[12:50]I don't know, they'd probably both be like,
[12:51]okay, you go.
[12:53]Go to that family, I'll take this family.
[12:56]How old are your kids now, by the way?
[12:58]I have 17-year-old, 15, 13, and almost 11.
[13:02]Wow.
[13:03]And what gender is I think?
[13:05]Rebois and then my youngest is for all.
[13:07]My oldest just got into college
[13:09]and it has completely adjusted my entire perspective
[13:12]on parenting.
[13:13]Everybody says, you know, it goes by in a blink.
[13:15]And all of a sudden, I've really realized he's leaving.
[13:20]And so I've been nicer to all of my children
[13:22]and spend time with me, give me an extra hug.
[13:25]All of a sudden, it's hitting me.
[13:29]I feel like I went through that early
[13:30]when my son went to boarding school at a very young age.
[13:32]And I mourned that.
[13:34]So I feel like by the time he goes to college,
[13:37]I'll just be like, no, yes, of course it does.
[13:41]It's crazy.
[13:42]I mean, to be honest, the fact that my son
[13:44]can now walk around the city by himself
[13:47]and it's not a big deal, like all of a sudden,
[13:49]that's been like the biggest shock to me.
[13:51]Like, okay, you're going to be hard to lie.
[13:53]And where you go?
[13:55]I mean, that's something I think about
[13:57]so my oldest can drive now and he'll go out.
[13:59]And you know, he sort of tells me where he's going.
[14:01]I had a general idea.
[14:03]But there's this letting go that's really difficult.
[14:07]And actually he was getting his license
[14:09]as I was finishing this book.
[14:11]And I was, you know, it's, there's this like,
[14:15]there's a scene in the book where Maggie,
[14:16]the woman who served as a surrogate,
[14:19]she's in New York and she has left her children
[14:21]and her son with a friend in Arizona.
[14:23]And she calls up her friend to say, you know,
[14:24]how's why it, you need me, what's happening?
[14:26]And the friend says he's fine, he doesn't need you.
[14:28]He's fine, go do yourself, he doesn't need you.
[14:30]And when she, they hang up the phone,
[14:32]the, he doesn't need you really resonates with Maggie.
[14:35]And she's like, wait a minute, you know,
[14:37]does anybody need me?
[14:38]And do we as parents need our kids more than they need us?
[14:42]And it's that's actually something that as I'm watching
[14:45]my own kids kind of get grown and flown a little.
[14:47]I'm really thinking about, you know, it's the same joke
[14:50]here about, you know, adults go out to dinner
[14:52]with their friends and show pictures of their kids.
[14:54]But, you know, their kids are on out,
[14:55]showing off pictures of their parents, you know.
[14:58]So it's an adjustment letting go.
[15:00]I will say that.
[15:01]I loved grown and flown the website, by the way.
[15:03]Do you ask me those days?
[15:05]Oh my gosh.
[15:06]Yeah.
[15:06]And Lisa and the book too, those, the collection of essays
[15:09]that I feel like that might have been two years ago.
[15:11]I had the month for that book,
[15:12]but those are really, those should come up
[15:14]like every year.
[15:15]They showed, they showed, it's it.
[15:16]I think it's like, it should be required reading.
[15:19]It should, yes, it should.
[15:21]Here is what to expect and you're expecting.
[15:23]And let's jump ahead to when they leave.
[15:25]And that is survive 18 years.
[15:28]Oh my goodness.
[15:29]So when you saw the article in people
[15:32]and you're like, I have to write this novel,
[15:34]what did you do next?
[15:36]Like, what happened and did you outline the whole thing?
[15:39]Like, and then how long did it all take?
[15:41]Like, what did that whole thing look like?
[15:43]So I knew the first thing I had to do was research
[15:46]because I wanted to really get it right with surrogacy.
[15:49]I think that the fact that surrogacy exists
[15:51]is a wonderful thing for so many people.
[15:53]And I didn't wanna write the book in a way
[15:56]that might dissuade and one from ever pursuing surrogacy
[15:59]as an option for their family.
[16:01]And I also just didn't wanna get anything wrong
[16:03]because I just, I feel like as an author,
[16:05]you have a responsibility when you're sort of introducing
[16:07]a concept to people who might not be familiar with it
[16:10]or writing historical fiction,
[16:11]whatever it may be, people think they're learning
[16:14]when they're reading your book.
[16:15]So you have this responsibility to kind of get it
[16:17]as right as you can.
[16:18]So the first thing I did, I happened to have a friend
[16:21]who had a baby for surrogacy and her child is now 17.
[16:25]So when she did it, it was sort of,
[16:27]it was less common than it is today.
[16:29]But I, she's a very close friend of my family.
[16:32]And so when she did it and as she's been raising her daughter,
[16:36]I sort of had a front row seat.
[16:37]So she was very generous and spoke to me at length about it.
[16:41]And then from there, I met with a woman who runs a surrogacy
[16:46]agency called Growing Generations.
[16:48]And she also, she was so enthusiastic about the concept
[16:51]for the book.
[16:52]And she put me in touch with other people who work
[16:55]at her agency who, I just coincidence,
[16:58]we're not coming to Natalie, but she was,
[16:59]she specifically chose one woman in particular
[17:01]who served as a surrogate herself three times.
[17:04]And this woman then put me in touch with other people
[17:07]who served as a surrogate.
[17:08]So I really spoke to a lot of people who gone through
[17:10]the process.
[17:11]It's been much easier, like where I live,
[17:14]I think there is a geographic component.
[17:15]And where I live, there are many more people
[17:18]who have used surrogates that who have actually served
[17:21]as surrogates.
[17:22]The only people that I have been in sort of like my social
[17:25]circuit, circle or my demographic area,
[17:29]who I might interact with who've served as surrogates,
[17:31]usually do it for someone they know.
[17:33]But the people who just do it, you know, getting paid
[17:36]have sort of, they're more like in the Midwest
[17:38]and more geographically spread out from me.
[17:40]But the good news is they're really, for the most part,
[17:43]very happy to talk about it.
[17:45]These women who serve as surrogates,
[17:47]for the most part, are these like,
[17:49]you can't believe how giving and generous they are.
[17:53]They really, they don't do it for the money.
[17:55]And the agencies won't accept women
[17:57]who they believe are doing it only for the money.
[17:59]They do it because they really feel, you know,
[18:01]how important it is to people to have children
[18:04]and that they, you know, for whatever reason,
[18:06]having easy time being pregnant,
[18:08]they enjoy it, whatever it is.
[18:09]And they just wanna give, you know, in some way
[18:12]to other families and there people who've done it
[18:14]three, four times, you know, after they've had
[18:16]three or four kids of their own.
[18:18]And it's sort of, I mean, it's astounding
[18:20]that these like putting up with the pregnancy
[18:22]and then, you know, and then giving away the child
[18:25]that they've been carrying for nine months.
[18:27]And then when they actually collect the payment,
[18:31]it's really, they use it for things
[18:32]that you would be surprised sort of how like frivolous
[18:34]they are like they'll go to Disney World
[18:36]or they'll buy like a little like some new furniture
[18:39]or they're living room or whatever it is.
[18:40]Like they really view the money as kind of bonus money.
[18:44]So that was a very interesting part of like learning
[18:47]that was very interesting for me.
[18:49]And also just getting to talk to all these people
[18:51]who are so giving was kind of exciting and fun.
[18:55]And then, you know, I spoke to doctors
[18:57]and like fertility specialists.
[18:58]I spoke to attorneys in the different states
[19:01]where the characters go because in each state
[19:04]in the country, it's certainly surrogacy laws are different.
[19:07]So I needed to talk to people in New York.
[19:09]I needed to talk to people in Arizona
[19:10]where the book kind of starts out.
[19:12]And then I also spoke to people in Arizona.
[19:14]So there was, and then, you know, was there any,
[19:17]I mean, and then I also, I spoke to parents
[19:19]who had adopted, I spoke to same sex couples
[19:23]who had like, you know, looked at all the options
[19:26]and decided not to have children.
[19:28]And there's been, you know, it sort of runs the gamut
[19:30]but it was a lot of fun to talk to all these different people
[19:34]and also to find the common threads
[19:36]in what they would tell me.
[19:38]So that was the bulk of it.
[19:40]Wow.
[19:40]And where do you like to do your writing?
[19:42]I do everything at home.
[19:43]I always thought when I, before I actually started
[19:46]writing full time that I would be one of those writers
[19:48]who like goes to a coffee shop
[19:49]and makes friends with everyone who works there
[19:51]and has my standard table, I can't.
[19:53]The minute I go into a public place,
[19:55]I am so fascinated by the world around me,
[19:57]especially the people, really.
[19:58]I don't care about the other stuff,
[20:00]the minutes someone walks into a store. I'm like, oh, what's she doing? What's she getting?
[20:04]And heaven forbid, I can't make sense. Like, oh, that's obviously like a husband and wife,
[20:09]or obviously like a mother and son. If I see like, you know, a guy who's in his 40s and I
[20:14]or not with a guy who's in his 20s, I'm like, is that an uncle and a nephew? Is it a file? Like,
[20:18]I just, I get immediately on like building a new story about these people. So job interview.
[20:25]Exactly. They worked. They used to work together.
[20:28]Yeah. And then maybe it's a college interview. Oh, college interview. That's not on my like,
[20:34]menu of options. Yeah, it could be anything. So I, so I stay home, which is generally great for me.
[20:41]It was a little harder during COVID when my, you know, the height of lockdown, when my husband,
[20:46]who I share in at home office was with was here every single day. And I discovered that 95% of his
[20:52]job is talking on the phone really loudly. But I, I developed the system. I put the airbuds in.
[20:58]And I actually started listening. I started the classical music. It wasn't working for me.
[21:03]lyrics distract me. So I ended up listening to Scottish, like classical Scottish music, which is
[21:09]mostly bagpipes. And it's now this like Pavlovian response. When I hear bagpipes, I get in the zone
[21:15]right away. And I'm like writing away. So, but he's, he's back in his office now. So I only have
[21:20]bagpipes twice a week when he works at home. That is so funny. You would rather be listening to,
[21:26]to bagpipes. No way. Then your husband chatting. Okay. Well, whatever. Great. And why do you
[21:31]found a way out of that? So funny. And how about now? What are you working on?
[21:38]So I'm at the tail end of another historical fiction novel. I have this bad habit of switching
[21:44]from genre to genre. And when I write, and I, I can't seem to stop myself, but I find these stories
[21:50]and I get very, you know, one track mind, like, this is the story I want to tell. And my first book
[21:56]was historical fiction. My next two were contemporary fiction. But when I was researching for the
[22:01]first historical fiction, I stumbled on a story about a runaway slave, a true story, and these two
[22:07]northern abolitionists who helped to this man. And it's a fascinating story that was a national
[22:14]sensation at the time that it occurred. This guy was, you know, a household name and these two
[22:19]abolitionists, Anne and Wendell Phillips, really did so much for the abolitionist cause. And they're
[22:24]not, most people don't know anything about them. And they're really interesting. And I, so I had
[22:29]to tell the story. And that's, that's what I've been working on. Wow. Yes. I was especially
[22:34]excited about it because Anne, the wife, was an incredibly influential abolitionist. And as a female
[22:40]at the time in which she was living, she sort of had to do all of her work through her husband.
[22:46]So it becomes, it's an interesting story. And it was that was super fun to research. And
[22:51]almost everything included in the book is like true history down to, you know, the eclipse that
[22:56]happened on a particular date where the newspaper articles that are quoted. So it's been a fun project
[23:01]for me. And I know you have this like tight knit group of fellow authors. How when did that come
[23:07]about? And like when did you consider yourself an author and how did, and what's like the importance
[23:12]of the author community to you? So I think many authors would say they're still, you know,
[23:19]they could publish 12 books and still not consider themselves an author. There's always this like
[23:23]imposter syndrome fear in the background. But I would say I got comfortable saying I was an author
[23:30]after my first book was published and you know, out there in the world. One thing when I was
[23:35]at a kid and trying to figure out my career and you know, would in passing say to my mother,
[23:39]you know, even I want to be a writer. And she would tell me, you know, that sounds lovely. But,
[23:42]you know, it's so much time by yourself. And it's really isolating. And you should think about that
[23:47]because you, you know, really like to be with people. And before I was a writer, I was a lawyer.
[23:52]And I have to say that I have made so many more friends as a writer than I ever made as a lawyer.
[23:57]The lawyer job, I felt very isolating and, you know, antisocial. But I, it's been incredible to be a part
[24:03]of this other community. I have found that the authors and I come across, everybody is so supportive.
[24:09]There's none of this, you know, competition. And if your book sells mine doesn't kind of idea,
[24:13]I think it's anybody's book succeeds. The book industry as a whole is succeeding and that's good
[24:18]for all of us. And I think there's an understanding of how hard it is to put your book out there,
[24:24]put yourself out there to take these risks. And so everyone is so supportive of each other in that
[24:30]awesome. And it's been, I mean, I remember before my first book came out, I went to hear
[24:36]a historical fiction panel. And I just happened to, you know, I just introduced myself to the authors
[24:40]who were on the panel. And then there was somebody's publicist was there in the publicist who,
[24:45]you know, was not my publicist was like, oh, you've got to meet this person who is a book
[24:49]stagrammer. This one who's another author and by the end of the night, I had 10 friends, you know.
[24:53]And it's like every day, I feel the community is growing. And it's really, it's really nice.
[25:00]And I'm actually just about to start a new writing group with a couple of authors who I've,
[25:06]you know, just met through going to things and being with people. And I so I love the writer
[25:11]life. That's great. It's true. You can, I mean, people A are so nice and B willing to help.
[25:18]And yes, I mean, there's this misconception that's so sweet your mom said that because that's
[25:22]something my mom would totally say to me, you know, like worrying about the things that they
[25:29]perceive. But I feel like when I'm writing, I, I don't know, I don't ever feel alone when I'm doing
[25:35]it. Like, I'm, it's like some other thing. It's like, you don't worry about feeling alone when
[25:39]you're like in yoga class or something. Yeah. Like, I don't know. It's like a different
[25:44]something self care. It's like, yeah, out of your head and sorting through your thoughts. And
[25:50]I agree. And I actually, I would know. It's like, I'm worried about you feeling alone because
[25:53]you've been doing so much running. Right. Right. Like you're like, no, of course you're alone,
[25:59]but you're, you know, you're listening to music and you're doing this and like, it's good for you. And
[26:03]you know, you're not really alone. I mean, you're even if you're at home on a treadmill, like,
[26:08]I don't know. I don't know. No, I agree with you. I think it's, it's, it's therapeutic on some level. And
[26:15]you know, I find it's almost like, you know, charging your cell phone. If that's how I am when I
[26:19]I write when I get up from the computer and go back out into the world, I have much more energy
[26:23]than I did before, you know, spending that time by myself and recharging like that. So, but,
[26:28]you know, I think it's funny, you know, the other thing my mom has said, but I keep talking about
[26:33]recently is, you know, one of the main catalysts in the book for everybody figuring out that
[26:40]there's a genetic situation that may have arisen is that the two dads and their sons decide to
[26:45]do like a 23andMe kind of a genetic test. And so everybody keeps asking me have I done a 23andMe
[26:51]and I have not because my mother has asked me not to. And what? So I'm like, wait a minute,
[26:58]if I didn't look so much like both of my parents, I would be really freaked out by this. But
[27:03]she doesn't want me to have my system, like the systems to have my information out there. She's
[27:10]she's concerned that, you know, first she's like, I don't really, you know, the government on the
[27:14]Jewish. Oh, I think that cat's out in the bag. Second, you know, it's just it's bad for identity,
[27:19]identity theft, whatever it may be. So I have my father did a test and he's 99.9% Eastern European
[27:26]Ashkenazi Jew, which was no surprise. They actually contacted him like a year, he did it like
[27:34]years ago. And they contacted him after they had sort of like refined their equipment. I guess
[27:38]they had new information and told him that he was 1% Irish. And I'm like, I knew it. I've always
[27:44]loved Ireland so much. It's sort of, you know, you take me back to the bagpipes, which is not exactly
[27:48]because Scotland, but then they contacted him a year later. And they said, no, it was a mistake.
[27:53]He's still just that's going to be Jewish. Oh my goodness. Well, I don't know. I mean, there are
[27:58]maybe there are other guys out there who look kind of like your dad. But it's been funny.
[28:04]I've been in some Facebook groups where I've been like talking with readers. And if I asked
[28:08]the question, have you ever done a DNA test? And did you, did you find out any surprises?
[28:13]One after another, after another, the comments are, you know, I discovered my dad was really my
[28:17]uncle or my father. My father. What any the craziest stories? And if that's just in these little
[28:23]Facebook groups with, you know, like a thousand members or whatever it may be. So there must be so
[28:28]many people out there who have discovered crazy things. So, you know, I think it's great for people
[28:33]who like that information. And for me, I've decided to take, to follow my mom's advice and
[28:39]decide that ignorance is bliss. You know. All right. Well, I don't know. That could be a memoir for you.
[28:45]Let's see what happens for sure. To the best. Okay. Last question, any advice for aspiring
[28:50]authors? Yes. I think the most important thing is to write as much as you can and not wait for
[28:57]the best idea you've ever had or the thing that you know is going to work and just sit your
[29:01]button the chair and get words on the page because once the words are down, you can edit,
[29:06]you can revise. And sometimes, just in the way that like talking with a friend may give you an
[29:11]idea and hope you think of something, actually putting words on the page may make you think of
[29:16]something that has nothing to do with the words you're writing that, you know, inspires a whole
[29:20]different stories. So I think, you know, if you're not, if you're not writing, you can't call
[29:24]yourself a writer. So you got to sit down and write. All right. Note it. All right. Awesome. Jackie,
[29:31]thank you. I really enjoyed your book. I loved the characters. The pacing was great. It like
[29:36]moved so quickly and you just kept wanting to like turn the page and figure out what was going to
[29:40]happen. And I was debating what I thought I would want to do in that scenario. Anyway, it was it made
[29:46]you think and feel and all the good things. So yeah, it's really great. Thank you so much. Thank you
[29:52]for having me. Okay. All right. I hope to see you soon. Bye. Bye. Thanks for listening to this
[30:00]Episode of Moms Don't Have Time to Read Books.
[30:02]Don't forget to follow me on Instagram,
[30:04]at Zebioans, and at Moms Don't Have Time to Read Books.
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[30:14]Thanks so much to Steve and Ryan at Textures Sound
[30:17]for the Sound Editing.
[30:18]And thank you to Morning Moon Productions
[30:20]for providing this fantastic intro and outro music.