Julie Wilcox, THE WIN-WIN DIET: How to Be Plant-Based and Still Eat What You Love
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[0:58]Julie Wilcox is the author of the win-win diet how to be plant-based and still love what you eat
[1:03]This is one of several podcasts that we're launching
[1:07]All at once to focus on food and nutrition and health and wellness
[1:11]Julie is a wellness consultant writer, teacher and coach who believes in personalized solutions that speak to individual needs as a founder of
[1:18]Julie Wilcox Wellness and co-founder of Isha Yoga
[1:22]Julie has taught thousands of clients individually and through corporate wellness programs
[1:26]Her personal and professional experience are backed by a master of science degree and nutrition and dietetics from NYU and national
[1:33]Certifications in yoga and fitness her articles and videos have been featured in Forbes Fox News mind buddy green parade
[1:39]Refinery29 and greatest to name with you
[1:42]She's also a consultant and advisory board member for Quincy Asian resources and NGO providing food security and health and wellness services to
[1:49]Underserved immigrant populations and executive wellness director of Jewish Orthodox Women's Medical Association
[1:56]Welcome Julie. Thank you so much for coming on mom's turn of time to read books to discuss the win-win diet
[2:01]Thanks and be it's wonderful to be here as always
[2:04]This is so crazy because how long I mean I feel like we've known each other since we were born basically, right?
[2:11]Actically yes
[2:13]I'd say probably around three years old. It's been a long time
[2:16]Wow, I feel like I have all these baby pictures of me even with like your sisters at like my birthday part of your something
[2:22]Like they were I mean your older sisters were like these cooler older girls and I don't know. It's just the coolest thing, right?
[2:30]I think we are
[2:31]So it's awesome to have friends that go that far back and it is unique. We're very lucky. I think it's true probably because so many of us have stayed right here
[2:41]Yes, we're in red e-workers. Anthony your girl always in New Yorker
[2:48]Okay before we dig into the specifics of the book
[2:51]Why how did you get into this whole area of interest? Nutrition food
[2:57]Lifestyle all of this wellness everything like give us the quick background from when you were three and we were hanging out to now
[3:06]Okay, so goes back pretty far but not quite that far
[3:10]But I was an Olympic aspiring gymnast as a kid
[3:14]started about
[3:15]At eight years old
[3:17]And practiced very intensively until I was 15 that was under Russian coaches about four hours a day
[3:25]Six days a week and often competed on the seventh
[3:29]So a very rigorous training to say the least
[3:32]And of course food and nutrition was
[3:36]An important topic of of conversation and life and lifestyle
[3:42]At that time it was
[3:44]Really geared towards showing up being you know extremely slim having very low body fat and
[3:51]You know enough energy to to compete at your highest level
[3:56]But ironically it didn't focus so much on individuality or even necessarily proper nutrition
[4:03]but what I did take away from that experience was an extraordinary amount of discipline and
[4:08]and structure
[4:09]And and the knowledge of how to to use that and implement that throughout my
[4:14]life
[4:15]To to my advantage essentially later. I became a yoga teacher and studio owner
[4:22]And at that time as an adult
[4:24]I really learned to bring mindfulness and balance into
[4:28]My equation to really kind of soften those rough edges perfectionist edges that I had
[4:33]you know as as a
[4:36]Kid and then certainly until I got to this point
[4:39]They still sort of lingered with me. So that brought me to a much more content place
[4:46]in all aspects of my life
[4:49]And then finally I went back to school to get my Masters of Science and Nutrition and Dietetics at NYU
[4:54]And I really was able to learn about the hard science of food and nutrition and that was
[5:00]really important and
[5:03]gave me that
[5:05]Knowledge about the the personalization when I spoke just a moment ago about you know even as a gymnast in kind of focusing diet on
[5:13]Your specific needs as an individual human being was was not attended to and when I went to school and I was I was studying
[5:23]An immersed in in the academics of it
[5:25]and reading all the research and and the evidence that's what came out most powerfully to me and
[5:32]I just am so passionate about it all and and
[5:35]finished the degree and dove into writing this book which really is about how to
[5:40]How to finesse a personalized diet personalized plant based diet. Wow. So
[5:46]Like what do you eat? What did you have for breakfast? Like what you're like
[5:50]What do you say like what do you eat in a day? Yeah, well this morning actually
[5:54]Was atypical because I I developed a new recipe this week
[5:58]Which was inspired by a dish I had in Miami about a month and a half ago and it's
[6:04]My my variation on it is half a papaya filled with tahini
[6:10]There's a little with honey and topped with some of my homemade granola, which the recipe for that is in the book and
[6:17]And some berries
[6:20]That was good. That was this morning typically. I will
[6:24]Otherwise have my antioxidant smoothie, which is also in the book and and I will top that with some of the granola as well
[6:31]And that's that's a that's a good. I think five day a week breakfast meal
[6:37]For lunch. I usually have my go-to salad
[6:40]Which is some kind of green lettuce often romaine or sometimes a rue gla
[6:46]cherry tomatoes walnuts cucumbers
[6:49]Avocado and then a plant-based protein or a couple slices of cheese or something and my white balsamic
[6:54]Addressing and then dinner and I'll usually have a um almond flour tortilla with that or if I have some leftovers of something from
[7:03]Dinner the night before maybe my plant-based meatballs
[7:06]Or some tofu whatever that maybe I'll throw that in
[7:10]And I'm kind of make it in little piles and it's really I mean delicious and beautiful
[7:15]And um and then for dinner, it's it changes up
[7:19]That's where I really kind of like to have them the most variety
[7:22]I believe in the discipline and the structure and the routine pretty much for two meals of the day for breakfast and lunch
[7:28]And then and then I have anything from fish to veggie bowls to pasta. Yes, I pasta pizza
[7:38]Tacos is a is a favorite
[7:41]Been really into Korean cuisine lately
[7:45]So then I do eat quite a bit of tofu. So I love that tempeh. Say tandishes
[7:49]That's you eat dessert. I know you have this avocado, but is it avocado moose or vegan moose or something?
[7:55]Because I was like yeah, yeah, I do eat dessert. I have a serious sweet tooth
[8:02]And that ranges from dark chocolate to
[8:06]We'll have occasionally some frozen yogurt
[8:09]Occasionally some ice cream. I have in the book also a whole wheat chocolate chip cookie recipe. That's an eggless recipe
[8:17]That's delicious
[8:18]So I'll make those and I'll freeze the dough and then when I want it
[8:21]We just heat them up my daughter and I have our fresh delicious home baked cookies
[8:26]So I do eat dessert
[8:29]And all these recipes so half your book not half yeah half your ruck ish
[8:34]Has all these amazing delicious sounding making me hungry
[8:38]type things started by you know category
[8:42]Did you invent all these recipes? I must like that's a whole skill set in and of itself
[8:46]It's like being a testing recipes and doing all that stuff. Did you have to do all that?
[8:50]I did I did
[8:53]It was fun. It's a creative process for me. Ironically. I've never been the type of person that can follow others recipes
[9:02]So I've had to rely on my own
[9:06]Creativity in the kitchen to to get anything done
[9:08]I'll always make mistakes if I follow others recipes
[9:11]So I just decided to start writing down what I was doing in the kitchen on my own and
[9:16]and then you know
[9:19]Disdeveloping new recipes. I work with the recipe editor once I sort of had
[9:24]You know a good portion of them down. So that was a fun experience and
[9:29]voila 95 recipes. Wow. Oh my gosh
[9:34]They all just sound so good and did you did you always like to cook like this? Is this a thing?
[9:40]I know you had trouble following others, but I mean like just in terms of an enjoyment standpoint
[9:46]Yeah, yeah, I mean when I was young we always had delicious food around the house
[9:51]My mother went to the quarton bloor in Paris when she was young
[9:54]So she was always
[9:56]Doing something interesting in the kitchen. So I had many years of observation
[10:00]patient. And she's a doctor. That's like, look at that. Yeah. So I think it was one
[10:06]after college and I started living on my own outside of the school context that I really
[10:12]started experimenting with cooking. And just kind of over the years, it came more and more.
[10:21]And I, it's something I really enjoy and I get my ideas from restaurants that I eat
[10:25]out at, you know, what other people make when I see beautiful pictures. So I just kind
[10:32]of harvest ideas from from all over the place and then do my own thing. Then I start start
[10:38]from scratch and I kind of take what I like, what I don't like. Maybe I want to add
[10:44]something new, some interesting flair or some herbs and spices. So that's about how it goes.
[10:52]So for somebody who's not eating a plant-based diet and I know you have different
[10:56]on-ramps, right, from this to that, this, you know, pescatarian, like, which is really useful
[11:03]and these are friendly in the book and everything. But how hard have you seen it with other
[11:08]with people you've tried to like coach into doing this or whatever to really morph into
[11:13]a new category and then be able to maintain that for a while and not just like test it out.
[11:18]If you do it gradually, which is my approach and methodology, it's not difficult. And that's
[11:26]the beauty of it is that it is sustainable. So unlike so many bad diets that are out there
[11:32]that, you know, you can do for a few days, a week, month, this is something you can do
[11:38]for life as long as you kind of go through the transitional periods and you do the assessments
[11:46]and make sure that your body is responding, okay, make sure that, you know, you're emotionally
[11:50]well, psychologically, well, you know, I go through the book exercises and ways to do those
[11:55]assessments. And if you go through that process, it's a smooth kind of ride.
[12:03]Well, so what was it like turning this into a book?
[12:11]I spent the year of the pandemic writing it. So I started January of 2019 and I thought
[12:17]it was just going to be sort of a side fun project. And I thought if I ever wanted to get
[12:23]it out there in the world, I might self publish it. That was kind of the only plan that
[12:29]I might have had in the back of my mind. And then the pandemic hit. And so I was going
[12:37]trying to kind of get back to my business and start building out my client base again
[12:41]after I'd finished, you know, the four years of school that I'd done. But when COVID came
[12:46]about, I just decided to put my nose to the computer and make this kind of a full-time
[12:52]ordeal. And so it took me a year to get a really solid draft on. And then I had some introductions
[13:01]to a couple of agents and publishers. And I went out to them. One of them picked it
[13:07]up and was very excited about it. And then it took about a year from the point at which
[13:13]I signed with them and that's post-ill press to the actual release date, you know, the
[13:20]whole kind of editing process designing the cover with them, designing the interior layout
[13:25]and structures. So, so great. So how long have you been keeping a plant-based diet?
[13:35]I was an omnivore until I was about eight years old. Then I became a vegetarian at about
[13:40]14. I saw film on factory farming in school, the ninth grade in biology class. And that
[13:47]really turned me off from meat. And at the same time, one of my sisters had already been
[13:51]vegetarian as well. And as you may well know, who we surround ourselves with really impacts
[13:57]the choices we make as far as diet is concerned. So I became vegetarian and I was vegetarian
[14:02]for 10 years. So theoretically, since I was 14, I was plant-based. But then after I graduated
[14:09]from college, I became Pescatarian, which is also a plant-based diet. And I've been Pescatarian
[14:17]amazing. And you go through all of what those things are, what the differences are with
[14:23]Pescatarian, what you can and can't eat and all that, you know. So what is the main benefit?
[14:29]I know you go through all of the different eating methodologies and everything. But if there's
[14:35]someone listening who's like, yeah, I'm not giving up meat, I just can't. Like, you've got to really
[14:40]convince me that this is worth it. Like, why is it worth the energy to convert?
[14:47]Yeah. So well, first of all, that person could be Pescatarian, which does allow for some
[14:52]amounts of meat and certainly dairy and eggs as well. And the idea there is to reduce the amount
[14:59]that you eat and make better choices about the quality that you're consuming. But to answer your
[15:06]question, any of the four eating patterns I cover in the book are associated with enhanced
[15:11]energy, sleep, immunity, strength, mood. And they all reduce the risk of a whole host of chronic
[15:21]diseases from type two diabetes to obesity, autoimmune disease, cognitive disorders, cancer,
[15:28]cardiovascular disease, and hypertension, of course. So the health benefits are myriad
[15:36]and then, of course, you also have, you know, doing a service to the environment and animal welfare,
[15:42]of course. Wow. So where do you want to take this whole enterprise of yours? Like, what's your
[15:49]goal? Like, what's your dream pie in the sky, blah, blah, blah? I just want to keep educating
[15:55]people. I'm doing a lot of speaking now at universities. I love working with that demographic
[16:00]because I feel that that age group is super hungry for this information ready to take it and use
[16:06]it. Already kind of thinking along those directions much more so than our generation and certainly
[16:13]our parents, you know, more concerned about the environment and more concerned about animal welfare
[16:17]even. And so education is a big part of that. I do that also in the nonprofit world. So
[16:25]you know, bringing the knowledge and the information to people that don't have easy access to it
[16:30]in, you know, public school systems, whether it's, you know, in the Bronx or other areas of the
[16:38]city that just, you know, are in need of the information and the food itself, you know.
[16:46]So I do a lot of work there. And then I'm working on another book as well.
[16:53]So that is definitely a project. And I'm back to my coaching business. So I work with
[17:01]individuals one on one. I work with corporations developing wellness programs for
[17:08]their employees. And then of course, educational institutions as well.
[17:14]Wow. It's really exciting. Yeah. Is there anything about this lifestyle?
[17:20]Like, do you ever feel constricted? Like, you want to rebel and like go off and like eat
[17:25]five bags of M&Ms or something? I don't because I give myself the space in the room and the
[17:32]allowance to basically do that. Um, you know, as I mentioned, I do eat dessert. I love sweets.
[17:40]And I am disciplined and structured enough of the time about how and what I eat and how much
[17:48]I eat, um, that if I want to go have, I mean, you'll never see me like, take a, you know,
[17:55]huge bag of Frito-Lay or something like that and, and eat the whole thing. Um, but, you know,
[18:00]I pretty much eat what I want. So it's not ultimately, this approach is not restrictive. Um,
[18:09]so it, I don't feel deprived. I don't want anybody else to feel deprived. I don't want people
[18:14]to feel like they have to make sacrifices, but they to learn how to, how to make space for,
[18:22]for the deliciousness that, you know, you want sometimes, but just not all the time.
[18:27]I'm sorry. I kept asking you. I keep asking you about yourself firstly. I know this is like a
[18:31]program for other people. I'm like, I'm curious about you. I'm sorry if I put you on the spot. Um,
[18:37]you can ask them. Whatever you want. Um, wait, let's say, what is your next
[18:42]book going to be about? My next book is about the qualities and traits that drive health and
[18:50]well-being. So the eternal personal qualities and traits as opposed to the foods we put in our mouth,
[18:56]the exercise we do, um, or anything else, because typically on this topic, it's always like,
[19:02]what can we do that's outside of, of ourselves, um, to, to enhance our health and well-being?
[19:08]And this is about, um, the, the internal, uh, necessities, essentially.
[19:15]That is really cool. Personality character traits, they're eight of them, actually.
[19:20]Which I'm not going to feel yet right now. Okay. Yeah, that sounds very, very interesting.
[19:25]I did have these with two extremely healthy people on how to get them. Wow. I like it.
[19:31]Um, you know, I did my senior thesis. I was a psych major and it was on how the application of
[19:37]social comparison theory, um, applies to eating disorders and like eating situations and how
[19:44]much you notice like what other people eat and how much people are working out and,
[19:48]and does that correlate with depression, anxiety, like history of eating disorders and all that stuff.
[19:54]And of course it does. What did you discover? I discovered that.
[20:00]Not really exactly and what's that no one had done that study before so I didn't
[20:05]Right, right good for you. Was it helpful to you?
[20:09]How are you thinking about your diet and plan to be speaking and
[20:14]Well, I have to tell you this like
[20:16]Double combo of keeping Passover and having COVID is is working wonders for my intake
[20:25]Yeah, so I feel pretty good this week
[20:28]Yeah
[20:31]Yeah, I mean my favorite thing these days is like
[20:34]When I'm not eating like sweets or something is this like veggie you based like thick yummy pureed soups
[20:41]I feel like I eat one of those for lunch. It like keeps me all the rest of the day
[20:46]soups are wonderful. Soups are amazing. I have five or six recipes in my book
[20:51]You have to try the creamy creamless broccoli soup. There's a classical entel soup
[20:56]There's a vegetarian French onion soup, which is to die for
[21:02]And there's an asparagus puree roasted butternut squash
[21:06]I found my website. I have some recipes that aren't in the book
[21:08]There's a coconut oil infused roasted carrot soup. So totally with you there
[21:14]Again, I usually like to to pair it with a little something on the side, but it definitely
[21:20]It definitely powers you through the day
[21:22]Yeah, so satisfying I think I really like hot foods
[21:27]Huh interesting interesting. So maybe it's hot. I don't actually feel satisfied
[21:32]Uh-huh. Well, that might have to do with your if you were looking at it through the lens of Ayurveda with your constitutional type
[21:39]So in Ayurveda, which is the ancient Hindu science of life. They
[21:45]believe that we each have
[21:47]Three elements that dominate our constitutions which are
[21:52]water or fire and air
[21:55]And the idea is that we have them all in harmony and in balance that would that's the ideal place that we all want to be
[22:02]But throughout life they inevitably get imbalanced and one tends to dominate
[22:08]so
[22:09]If you're the the fire person the pit of person. It's called you would want to gear your diet towards
[22:16]more cooling
[22:18]Towards more cooling foods essentially
[22:21]And if you're a coffee person the water one then you you might need a little bit more spice and warmth and
[22:29]Things that are you know, just more energizing and comforting
[22:34]So that's a whole area of interest that you know, I learned from my years as a yoga teacher
[22:42]That's cool to sort of delve into
[22:45]That could be that that could be you might be a coffee person and therefore you
[22:49]Are eating pitta foods to sort of balance out
[22:53]Interesting. Well, thank you for that
[22:57]Yeah, it's been more recent that I've noticed that like why I'm like, you know
[23:01]My husband like cools things off and I'm like we have to it's ready. Let's eat right now
[23:07]It's interesting
[23:10]I love it. Well, see I'm a fire person. I'm a pit of person
[23:14]So I'm always looking for the cooler foods and that's why I at night like
[23:18]Desserts are typically something that's like a frozen dessert, you know
[23:23]It'll be like a frozen yogurt or an ice cream or sorbet or you know something that's cooling a moose like that
[23:29]And my salads are you know, that's what I typically that lunch also
[23:32]I just like hold her foods and I believe that is also like
[23:36]Working out that balance that that I don't quite have
[23:39]Interesting, so my life is not in balance
[23:43]Else or freeze
[23:45]Maybe after we finished google go look at the douche. Yeah, I feel like I did. I learned about that at some point. I did the um
[23:52]What was it even called I did some online your long course Center for something
[23:59]Nutrition yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah integrated institute of integrated nutrition. I did a long time ago
[24:06]Have I did learn about that and then I forgot it right after so there we go. I'm too refresh your memory. I was very refreshed
[24:12]Absolutely
[24:14]Um, okay. Well having written a book and gotten through this whole process. What advice would you have for aspiring authors?
[24:21]I would say at this point
[24:24]um
[24:27]You know, I wrote my entire manuscript
[24:30]Before I went out with it and interestingly when I met with my editor the other day
[24:35]I was like can I now just write the puzzle and go out with that because I mean
[24:41]It was great that I got the manuscript done
[24:43]And I don't think I would have gotten a publisher had I not gone that route as a first-time author
[24:48]Um, but you know, there's something nice to think that you can just start with a proposal and
[24:53]She told me I'm curious to know what your thoughts are that
[24:57]It's actually going more in the other direction now and if you can have a full manuscript done
[25:02]Um, that certainly can work to your benefit. Well, what are your thoughts on that?
[25:08]Um
[25:09]It depends. I get I think it's always better to have it
[25:15]Right. I mean when we're evaluating manuscripts. It's like I could I could I could hope that this proposal
[25:22]Would be good or I could see that this one is good
[25:25]So it's not that it would eliminate one
[25:27]But if you have to choose between an unknown and a known you can always work with something in the known
[25:33]Right, you can always say okay. This is good. Let's keep this part. Let's delete this start over here
[25:38]um
[25:40]Like one book we basically had her rewrite but I don't know if we would have taken our book if we hadn't seen it
[25:47]Right, right
[25:48]So that's one piece of advice I'd give if you if you can write the whole manuscript
[25:53]That's I think a good way to go. The other thing is is of course always who you surround yourself with is
[26:00]really meaningful and
[26:03]You know depending on the type of writer art you are you can definitely kind of get your work done and then sort of get eyeballs on it
[26:11]I
[26:12]Personally worked with a development editor which was
[26:16]Necessary for me just because I wanted someone that was really an expert in food and given the topic that I was covering
[26:22]Because even the recipes, you know, there are so many details that
[26:26]Are needed in and how you exactly write a recipe
[26:30]And so I didn't want to have to back track a ton
[26:33]so I had her on from the beginning and
[26:36]That was really really helpful
[26:39]And then at other stages of the process later on
[26:42]I brought in a couple other people also that had different perspectives from the from the food world like a woman who
[26:49]Was working with she was a coaching business
[26:51]Her name is Tina Cowan. She's amazing for anyone that is looking to write a food oriented book
[26:57]And she was editor in chief of food in wine for 20 years
[27:01]So when I got to the the and she's written her own books
[27:04]So when I got to the the point of publishing and social media and marketing
[27:08]She was just an amazing resource of information
[27:12]For all that so that was great and then lastly I'd say
[27:16]You know the more you can build out all your platforms
[27:20]You know prior to to publication the better off you are because
[27:25]I'm sure many people that are listening and getting to this who have done some research on on how to publish a book
[27:30]I've heard this but
[27:32]Definitely look at those numbers and want to see that you you have a following
[27:36]I think maybe more so for nonfiction
[27:39]I think if you have an amazing novel it lends a new desk. I don't think it matters as much
[27:45]That could be that could be I mean
[27:47]Look, I don't have a huge following myself and and I got you know my book published
[27:51]So I don't think it always matters but
[27:55]That's the message that I got from the very beginning
[27:58]So I got you all gave me that message too
[28:00]I was like
[28:03]All right, yeah
[28:03]And if it's not true for fiction or for the books that you guys take in kudos to you
[28:08]That's amazing because I feel personally that it shouldn't be all that important
[28:12]I think it's kind of taking up too much space in our world in our lives
[28:17]I totally agree as I spend like an entire day on social media with my book luncheon, you know
[28:21]I'm like does this even do anything? I don't know
[28:25]I don't know
[28:26]If people are trying to solve this mystery formula all the time but
[28:29]But you know, you have to find other creative ways also of selling books
[28:32]And that's something that I'm still learning at this point in the process
[28:35]Like speaking at these universities like it's a great gig
[28:38]Because not only do I get to do the part that I love which is the education and interaction
[28:43]With um with students, but the university is then by like chunks of books. That's really smart. Yeah, that's right
[28:49]I love it and for me
[28:51]I think that I sell more books that way probably at this point that I do through social media so
[28:56]Yeah, and then you know another another route that I'm going to is my book is gonna be carried in spas
[29:02]So
[29:03]That's also phenomenal
[29:05]So I think people just really need to explore all different avenues as to how to get the book out in the world
[29:11]And there are many and so many that you even think of at first
[29:15]Which is it again?
[29:16]Did you contact each individual spot or have you partnered with a chain or how are you doing that?
[29:21]So one that I'm sure you know of is natural pathica. Yeah
[29:26]So they have they have spas in the Hamptons and in New York
[29:31]And since I and you have been going out this
[29:34]Ever since we've known each other that just sort of was like a natural
[29:38]Collaboration so pretty much like places that I love to go or people that I know
[29:43]They're in so you want to have your allies because also like I have a definitely a small group of people that
[29:49]You know are doing a lot of work for me for free whether it's family whether it's friends
[29:53]And you know we're getting the word out and have connections places and
[29:57]And they hook you up. So that's that's great
[30:00]love it. Thank you Julie. This is so fun. Congratulations on your book and I'm excited for you.
[30:07]Thank you and I hope you get better soon and congratulations on everything that you're doing and
[30:13]good luck on. Thank you. I want to try some of these recipes. That's my yes, you absolutely need to.
[30:19]Please do and if you have any questions about any of them let me know. Okay. All right. Bye bye.
[30:24]Okay. Thanks for listening to this episode of moms don't have time to read books
[30:30]don't forget to follow me on Instagram at zebioens and at moms don't have time to read books.
[30:35]Also sign up for my newsletter at zebioens.com and sign up for my virtual book club and meet lots
[30:40]of authors on zoom every other week. Thanks so much to Steve and Ryan at Textures Sound for
[30:45]the Sound Editing and thank you to Morning Moon Productions for providing this fantastic intro and
[30:49]now trim music.