Josie Silver, ONE NIGHT ON THE ISLAND: A Novel
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[1:01]ZI BBY and AG the literary lifestyle destination with essays book news a lit lifestyle feature and
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[1:13]Josie silver is the author of one night on the island a novel
[1:17]Josie is the unashamed romantic who met her husband when she stepped on his foot on his 21st birthday
[1:23]She lives with him their two young sons and their cats in a little town in England called Wolverhampton
[1:28]By the way, she is the number one New York Times best-selling author of one day in December and the two lives of Lydia Bird
[1:35]Welcome Josie. Thank you so much for coming on mom. Don't know time to read books to discuss one night on this island
[1:42]Thank you. Thank you for having me. It's really excited to be here. I apologize. I might tune my bedroom
[1:47]I don't normally do this from my bedroom
[1:49]But my office in the garden the neighbors are having work and there's lots of bang in so I thought I'll come up here and hopefully it's gonna be quiet
[1:56]That's totally fine. I'm in my bedroom too, but nobody needs to know all of this
[2:02]You're right rewind right? I'm in the corner. Nobody can see. It's fine. It doesn't matter
[2:08]I almost didn't even get out of my pajama pants, but I did
[2:12]So you are at number one New York Times best-selling author. You are a Reese's book club pick
[2:18]Now you have a new book out before you talk about the new book
[2:21]I want to know what it's like going from that to having to write another book once you've had such a massively
[2:27]Successful experience and then being like, okay. Now. I'm just gonna sit and face the blank page again. What does that like? Oh my gosh
[2:33]I mean, it was I think the word is probably terrifying
[2:36]This is actually my second book since that one. So this one wasn't so bad
[2:40]But I mean, that was just such a
[2:42]unexpected kind of roller coaster from
[2:45]You know it the New York Times number one best-selling spot at Christmas which was kind of like
[2:50]All of my Christmas has come at once
[2:53]It was just the most surreal and brilliant kind of
[2:57]Experience, you know for for my first josey book as well
[3:00]It wasn't actually my first book. I've been writing for more than a decade
[3:04]But it was my first josey silver book and it was just
[3:08]Phenomenal and then to try and sit down afterwards and think okay. What's next? It was difficult, but actually
[3:15]I feel so lucky to do this job anyway because it's kind of my dream job
[3:19]So it was difficult, but you know if someone's paying you to do it you have to keep your book in the seat and that's you do
[3:27]Yeah, I mean, I just feel incredibly fortunate to be honest. Go back a second to why different pen names
[3:34]Why different branding?
[3:37]How did you get started? All of that. Yeah, I mean, I always wanted to write, but
[3:42]The time has never kind of arrived in my life, you know, took an office job that I didn't particularly like
[3:47]But then you know how life happens. I got married. I had kids and it was only when I was a maternity leave that I thought
[3:53]I really don't want to go back to that job of you know, I'm gonna give it a go enter some competitions
[3:58]And and I was looking up to play second in a Muslim boom competition here, Harlequin and
[4:04]That was sort of the springboard. I ended up not being published by them in the end
[4:08]But that really did kind of give me the I worked with an editor and it gave me a real taste and you know
[4:15]There was no going back when I kind of started and then I self-published because it was
[4:20]2012 and that was kind of just in its infancy
[4:23]And so I was quite an early adopter with that and that went really well and that was more sort of it was romance
[4:28]But it was hot romance. It was around the 50 shades kind of time, you know, but that was all of what was was being picked up
[4:34]so
[4:36]I went into that direction and de once and de one
[4:39]Sudan him and then more towards romantic comedy writing for HarperCollins under the pseudonym cat French
[4:47]Which did fine and you know, we're bald along. Okay, and then when it came to
[4:52]writing one day in December, it's just
[4:55]a slight shift more towards serious women's fiction
[4:58]So it felt like a good time
[5:01]For a bit of a rebrand and just to refresh everything and I moved from HarperCollins to penguin
[5:06]So it was a good point really to kind of press the reset button
[5:09]And it went far better than even I expected it to and certainly better than the publisher expected it to
[5:14]And you know, it just everything kind of it was like the stars aligned
[5:18]So it was like a 10 year amble up to
[5:21]The New York Times. It wasn't
[5:23]You know, it can look on the outside kind of as a debut and as a you know an instant thing and you know
[5:28]How fortunate would that be?
[5:30]But it really was kind of building up to that point for the decade before
[5:35]Well, okay, so then and then you wrote one day in December then the next book that was the Lydia
[5:42]No, yeah, but that's all right. Yeah, but okay
[5:45]Which was very different again more more kind of entrenched in grief and we could be really so
[5:51]So then you know, it was kind of such a flip around to write that kind of book for writing that I hope for book with one day in December to become
[5:58]In far more
[5:59]It's a deeper book Lydia bad and it was harder to write by far
[6:03]You know with a balancing of the two parallel universes and it was quite a test to write that one
[6:09]Had you been going through grief in your own life. Is that what made you go in there?
[6:13]Very fortunate that the answer to that is no
[6:17]I was lucky to have quite a lot of
[6:20]input from people on forums now. Maybe like friends in
[6:25]In that kind of area that had been through difficult stuff
[6:28]And they were really kind and opened up and shared their experiences and the thing that kind of stood out to me
[6:34]Was that everyone's journey is different
[6:36]So know how one person will react. He's absolutely different and everybody's journey is okay. So moving from that book then to
[6:45]This book now one night on the island, which is
[6:49]Kind of a return to the more hopeful upbeat vibe of
[6:54]One day in December. It's nice actually to have gone back to that kind of balance of romantic comedy
[6:59]And now
[7:00]This is a long way to get to this question, but why don't you tell audiences when that one night on the island?
[7:07]Okay, well that book is about a girl called Cleo who's turning 30 and she's kind of at crisis point
[7:14]She's reached this she's a date in journal, especially really jaded and
[7:19]Her boss sends her away to an island an Irish island called Salvation Island and her mission is to marry herself
[7:25]That's what she goes for which kind of sounds comedic
[7:30]Any ease in one sense, but in another way, it's kind of
[7:33]She's discovering she needs to kind of strip strip back down and discover who she is and what makes a tick
[7:40]And what she's really looking for because she's kind of
[7:43]Got into this route of thinking that she's half a person looking for her other half
[7:49]And what she really needs to kind of embrace is that she's already whole and that she's
[7:55]on her own, you know
[7:58]Single doesn't mean necessarily mean lonely
[8:01]So it's kind of self-empowerment really and self-disguffing me and
[8:07]She goes away to this remote Irish island to this little cabin
[8:12]To do this and when she gets there. She discovers
[8:16]That someone else has already gone there to do exactly that to be alone. Who is Mac? Who is this?
[8:23]Tall, handsome, very grumpy American photographer who's kind of at an emotional point in his life too
[8:30]But for very different reasons, so he's you know, he's just come off the back of a
[8:35]Emery that he considered to be happy, but he's discovered that his wife wasn't happy and they've separated
[8:41]And he has two little boys who he is absolutely there his world and he's trying to navigate how to be a father
[8:49]With a living in the same house
[8:52]And he has his own issues
[8:54]fatherhoods a massive issue for him anyway because his own relationship with his daddy so complicated
[8:59]So he is kind of in a really
[9:02]Is at the bottom, you know, he's really in a difficult position and he's gone there to kind of take a breath
[9:08]Be alone
[9:10]And the last thing he wants is a roommate
[9:13]but they find themselves
[9:15]stuck together in this lonely place and
[9:18]They've both gone to be alone and the last thing they want is romance
[9:23]But you know life happens doesn't it and romance kind of finds its way between the cracks if it's gonna be there and it's
[9:30]There was such a fun couple to write because they're so sparky and so different
[9:35]And I don't know if I mean, you know the old movie the old parent trap movie
[9:40]Yeah, yeah, I love the relationship between the parents in that and they were kind of in the back of my head when I was writing this book
[9:47]You know that that funny sparky charismatic kind of relationship. So yes, so that's kind of the the basics of it
[9:54]But then it's set on
[9:56]Salvation Island which is
[9:58]my dream
[10:00]island basically. I looked obviously it was written during the pandemic so I couldn't go and visit
[10:07]the you know the remote Irish islands so I spent lots of time researching and reading and
[10:13]watching videos and that stuff and kind of cherry picked all the bits of other islands and
[10:19]created this perfect small island with this eccentric cast of characters that form the perfect
[10:28]backdrop really for Cleo and Mack to get to know each other and to find what they need.
[10:35]Amazing. I actually listened to part of this on audiobook which was very I love the accents and
[10:42]the whole thing and it's like so immersive to get into this world and I also kind of love
[10:49]I'm 45 but the idea that like I remember turning 30 and that felt sort of like the end of the
[10:54]world to me at that time and then turning 40 felt the same way and now I'm like oh my gosh turning 50
[11:00]so I feel like she's in that moment where it's like you just can't believe you're about to hit
[11:05]the next decade and oh my gosh is it over what what next? I know that's exactly the position I'm in
[11:10]personally now just turn 50 and I'm like oh my god what's this happen? How do I reach this number?
[11:17]You know and it just it I mean it shouldn't matter but it just kind of does doesn't it?
[11:23]It feels a bit seismic and I think that's the position that she finds herself in is this
[11:29]you know she needs to shake everything up and then see which this matter and which bits don't.
[11:35]I feel like after you graduate from school there aren't as many milestones you know it used to just
[11:41]be all about getting to the next grade and then and that was like a way to mark time but when you're
[11:46]just sort of living I either mark it by my own kids ages or big milestone ages for me and then
[11:54]all of a sudden you're like wow okay it's a double whammy here I turned 50 just a few weeks ago
[12:03]I must have turned 18 so it's kind of he's at the other end of his journey and I'm like oh gosh
[12:08]you know so but being a parent I think him forms so much of well definitely of my wife team you know
[12:15]and parent who is a big theme of the book and I've got two boys as well so I guess that kind
[12:19]of came easy yeah hell do you boys 18 and when 18 and coming 16 so yeah I mean I just difficulties
[12:30]and you know for different reasons but this age it's just the you know letting going a little
[12:36]bit age and that's kind of difficult you know the taking I mean my eldest is going on his first
[12:41]holiday with his friends in a few weeks and I'm like oh my god how am I going to go
[12:46]in forms you've already nothing doesn't it all those feelings kind of come out on the page and
[12:50]I have I have 215 year old I have 15 year old twins a boy and a girl and then I have two little
[12:56]guys nine and seven but with my older son it's like he'll be like all right I'm going out right
[13:02]like he'll leave the place and I'll be you know I'm like we'll check in and I know it's just the
[13:07]beginning of all of it but when you see somebody you I don't know this sounds ridiculous I know
[13:12]I'm so obvious but just like that if like I was just 15 two seconds ago and now he's 15 and going
[13:19]out and doing all these things what does that say about me you know like what where is my
[13:25]like it's like it's his turn now right it's their turn and I kind of assumed that my parents
[13:32]life was like whatever but it like it was all about me growing up right they were like if you're
[13:35]at that age forget it and now that I'm that age I'm like so I'm absolutely like I find it so
[13:42]difficult but I think especially having been through the pandemic because you know we've had two
[13:47]years of being kind of locked in force proximity everywhere we've all you know not had to worry about
[13:54]them going out and doing stuff so my audition particular kind of went from being 16 and not doing
[14:00]anything to know 18 and wanting the world and there's none of that little letting out you know
[14:06]bit by bit is described from being being a little boy to suddenly being a training man and wanting
[14:12]to do everything and wanting us to back off and that's just it's it's life isn't it but it's just
[14:18]so so difficult so yeah I'm finding a glass of wine is really helping at the end of the day
[14:23]do you feel like the writing helps like do you feel like yeah absolutely it's my escape
[14:32]absolutely I mean I had a and God not to spelt just before the pandemic actually so I was quite
[14:38]fortunate that I had that put in before anything happened so I've got a sanctuary down there
[14:44]because this house you know it's noisy and it's all boys and so I kind of go down the garden
[14:50]shut the door and it's like okay this is my space and you know it just is a sanctuary I think and
[14:57]I just you know absolutely love I mean I love writing anyway I can't believe I actually get paid to do
[15:03]it so yeah I mean it all goes in doesn't it everything that happens around you kind of comes out
[15:11]on the page in some way it was the same with the pandemic you know my idea with writing one night on
[15:16]the island I didn't want to mention the pandemic I didn't want to it to come onto the page at all
[15:22]but it kind of still does it subconsciously through the force proximity and not being able to get
[15:29]away from each other the pandemic definitely informed the story yeah there are like abandoned
[15:34]alone I mean it's like and like out it's like out of your control like they're there for a
[15:42]you know it's like where there is against them and the boat is they just cannot escape the island
[15:47]so they kind of stuck yeah just what happens when life goes one way and suddenly from one minute to
[15:52]the next it's very very different and you can't do much about it I feel like there's that there's
[15:58]that same vibe right it's just like this way and now like whisking out of the editorial rooms or
[16:05]whatever magazine and like just being or a wellness item whatever it was and then then just being
[16:10]like in nature and like what does it even mean to marry yourself and you know all this stuff
[16:15]but I feel like there was so much not pressure but advice to getting through these hard times of
[16:21]like self-care and doing this and ultimately I don't know if it's effective or not but then the
[16:28]pressure to do that adds on to everything else right the pressure for self-care do you know
[16:32]do you know what I mean or maybe it's a big use of it you know it's all well and good isn't it
[16:37]but sometimes I think it's too much isn't it and some some people's I do of self-care
[16:42]is other as idea you know of hair isn't it because people just don't want to do that
[16:48]quiet calm thing some people need that noise and that energy you know and it everybody has to kind
[16:54]of find their own way and I think that is very much the theme of the book and it's about
[16:58]finding what works for you yeah I love that you have been into writing romantic comedies or
[17:05]romances forever and I love to the picture that you posted of the cassette tape because I
[17:10]still have some of my old tapes I used to listen to like menor from Mars women are from Venus on
[17:15]tapes like in my car commuting to work and I would put in the cassette and like listen to it back
[17:20]and forth but that's amazing that you A did that and B saved the tapes I do know what it's one of
[17:27]my most precious possessions now I absolutely I'm so glad that that I did because it kind of for
[17:32]me validates me you know to me I did want to do it when I was 14 and I might be 15 now but you know
[17:40]it's been the running theme of my whole life is wanting to do to do what I do now and you know
[17:47]don't take it for granted at all yeah I was so I was having my first well my my eldest is 18 so
[17:56]my youngest is 16 so it's been 15 years that I've been writing kind of so I was I was
[18:02]34 35 when I started and you know I just sometimes think gosh what we should start when I was
[18:09]when I intended to do it you know when I was younger but I think things kind of you know life
[18:16]just is life isn't it and I don't think I was ready perhaps when I was younger and you know I think
[18:22]if anything you just kind of you just got to do it haven't you know we should have done it earlier
[18:27]but I'm just glad I did it at all or maybe maybe it wouldn't have been as good I mean you can
[18:32]have the skills but until you have the experience it's almost like being a chef and you have like
[18:38]amazing knife skills but if you're only practicing on like I don't know a cucumber you're not
[18:44]going to make the best meal you know we're absolutely right I think bringing more life experience to
[18:50]the table definitely helps kind of with depth you know and with just you know you have to have
[18:56]your heart broken I think to write about it convincingly don't you? I love definitely had my
[19:00]broken a few times yeah I was gonna I was wondering you know why do you know why you've been so
[19:07]drawn to romance your whole life like do you know where that came from? I think it came I mean my
[19:13]mom is a massive rate of romance my my nan was a massive rate of romance no I've got it
[19:19]memories of a little girl you know she had her stack of meals and beans next to the television and
[19:25]she'd changed in every week at the library and I'd go with there and you know it's been like a
[19:29]ruling theme through my life but I just I just you know I'm always drawn to it anyway I'm drawn to it
[19:36]in movies and I'm drawn to it in books it kind of just sees my thing I'm just you know I've tried
[19:42]to do other things and I can't I can't write dark thrillery stuff I had to go and it was just
[19:48]it just wasn't working for me I think I just I just love romance and I love love and it just is
[19:52]about human connection isn't it and I think it's just fascinating so yeah I can't imagine
[20:00]that would ever want anything else.
[20:01]Well, another.
[20:04]I feel like it's the same with styles of writing.
[20:07]Like I feel like I've experimented with so many styles.
[20:10]And I'm like, ooh, maybe I should write this
[20:11]like as like a first like present tense literary novel.
[20:15]Like I am in the dark room and I am doing that.
[20:18]You know what I mean?
[20:19]And I'm like, okay, I can do that,
[20:21]but it's just not very good.
[20:22]You know, that's just not who,
[20:24]that's not like my voice.
[20:26]That's not what I'm in to.
[20:28]So I think it takes some confidence or time
[20:31]or maybe reader feedback to realize
[20:34]that maybe what you like doing the most
[20:36]is actually the thing that people might like reading the most.
[20:39]Yeah, definitely.
[20:40]I think I certainly prefer writing in first person now.
[20:43]I used to write mostly in third, but first,
[20:46]it's so immediate isn't it?
[20:47]And so kind of in there and immersive.
[20:49]And I think I prefer to read first as well now.
[20:51]I love first person.
[20:52]I think that's why I like reading memoir so much.
[20:55]You know, like I just want to hear someone's story.
[20:57]I want someone to tell me a story.
[20:59]Maybe I don't go back to bed time.
[21:00]It's like bed time as a kid or something.
[21:04]But in terms of your process,
[21:06]how do you approach books?
[21:08]Like do you know, do you have an outline?
[21:09]Do you know what's gonna happen
[21:10]with all of your characters when you set out?
[21:13]I would love to say yes, but the answer is scary now.
[21:17]I usually have the beginning in my head
[21:20]and I know roughly where I want them to end.
[21:23]And perhaps a couple of the kind of pivotal scenes
[21:26]that I know I'm gonna include somewhere along the way.
[21:28]But then after that, it's very much a case of
[21:32]getting to know them on the job.
[21:34]So, you know, sit down and write
[21:36]and they say things and they do things
[21:37]and you think, oh, okay, that's the kind of person
[21:40]you're gonna be.
[21:41]And I find it a really terrifying way to work,
[21:44]but I've tried plotting, you know,
[21:47]and I find it kind of deadens the story for me.
[21:50]So I have to kind of write it as it goes.
[21:54]And I write linear, you know, start to finish
[21:56]rather than dotting around and try and write it quickly.
[22:00]So, you know, I would try, I'd rather write
[22:03]five or six thousand words a day and stay in the book
[22:07]rather than hit right here and then have breaks.
[22:09]If I have breaks, it kind of leaves me.
[22:11]So rather sit down for, you know, as many weeks as it takes
[22:15]and just stay in the book and feed everyone cornflakes
[22:18]three meals a day.
[22:19]Yeah.
[22:21]And they're kind of get it now.
[22:23]And it's chaotic on the outside to look in,
[22:25]but it's just my process and I've embraced it
[22:27]rather than try and fight it.
[22:30]Yeah, I usually have three months of chaos while I'm writing
[22:32]and then the rest of the year is, you know,
[22:35]the tidying up and the editing and all of that
[22:37]just that makes it sparkle.
[22:39]If you could change the thing about the publishing industry,
[22:43]what would be fast?
[22:45]Oh, God, I don't know.
[22:46]I think perhaps to take romance more seriously,
[22:48]you know, and to take women writers more seriously
[22:51]in the industry and to, you know,
[22:53]romance is kind of the biggest selling genre
[22:56]and the most looked down on say, I think if anything,
[22:59]it would just be to respect the romance genre more.
[23:04]It's true.
[23:05]I mean, that is our basic human instinct is love connection.
[23:10]It is how our species survives literally.
[23:13]So there is some like evolutionary pull to this hearing
[23:16]the stories, right?
[23:17]And there's something very soulful feeling about going
[23:20]through someone's love story and going through the motions
[23:23]and learning from that.
[23:24]Yeah, absolutely.
[23:25]It isn't it.
[23:26]It's humanity, isn't it?
[23:28]And it's the basic connections,
[23:30]but it's family, isn't it?
[23:32]And I live right in about sisters and, you know,
[23:35]legendships with family and how they kind of all interact
[23:38]and the emotional inheritance, I think,
[23:40]is a lot of the theme that are kind of harped
[23:43]up to with this book was particularly
[23:46]with Mack and his children, you know,
[23:47]about how Mack's experience is informed his life
[23:51]as a father and I think that's what's fascinating
[23:55]with people, isn't it?
[23:56]You know, the whole how everything that's happened to us
[23:59]kind of makes us who we are and that impacts our children
[24:02]and the people that we love.
[24:04]And yeah, just I think human connection is the thing
[24:08]that kind of pulls me back constantly to writing love stories.
[24:12]I run it too that to write them,
[24:14]you have to withdraw from all human connections to do so.
[24:17]Yeah, I'm going to make no one speak to me.
[24:19]Yeah.
[24:20]I'm going to get to the point, don't you,
[24:23]where your characters are, your everything
[24:26]and everything that's going on in their life is massive.
[24:28]What's happening in your life is going to secondary?
[24:30]Yeah, but that's the fun of the job, isn't it?
[24:33]I wouldn't change it.
[24:34]Thank you so much.
[24:35]This has been so much fun.
[24:36]Thanks for the chat and the books and everything.
[24:39]And I wish you all the best.
[24:41]And I hope that your son comes home early.
[24:45]Me, thank you.
[24:46]And congratulations on your success, too.
[24:48]You know, it's wonderful to hear.
[24:50]So yeah, I'm looking forward to any book.
[24:52]OK.
[24:52]All right, thanks so much.
[24:54]Thank you.
[24:54]Bye.
[24:55]Bye, bye, bye.
[24:58]Thanks for listening to this episode of Moms.
[25:00]Don't have time to read books.
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[25:13]Thanks so much to Steve and Ryan at Textures Sound
[25:16]for the Sound Editing.
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