Dr. Charles Sophy, FAMILY VALUES: Reset Trust, Boundaries, and Connection with Your Child
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[1:03]Dr. Charles Sophie is the author of Family Values, Reset Trust, Boundaries, and Connection
[1:08]with Your Child.
[1:09]I met Dr. Sophie when he did an event with my friend Rebecca Rafael here in New York City,
[1:15]at Lisa Blousehouse.
[1:16]And I was like, oh my gosh, I'm going to have to have you on my podcast.
[1:20]He was quite a character and I couldn't wait to have him on a few months later, which
[1:24]is now.
[1:25]Dr. Charles Sophie is a psychiatrist and the former medical director of the County of
[1:29]Los Angeles Department of Children and Family Services.
[1:32]He has been a staple in Dr. Phil for the last 20 years.
[1:35]He now brings his experience and expertise to his book Family Values, continuing his work
[1:40]on repairing parent child relationships just as he did in his previous publication, side
[1:44]by side, the Revolutionary Mother Daughter Program for Conflict-Free Communication.
[1:48]In addition to his work with Dr. Phil, Dr. Sophie has appeared on television programs such
[1:52]as today, Good Morning America, CNN's Larry King Live, Anderson Cooper 360, and on the Fox News
[1:57]channel.
[1:58]Welcome Dr. Sophie.
[1:59]Thanks so much for coming on mom's time to read bugs to discuss Family Values, reset
[2:04]trust, boundaries, and connection with your child.
[2:07]Thank you for having me.
[2:08]It's my pleasure.
[2:10]So you are a total expert.
[2:12]Tell me what this book delivers that nobody else can deliver for parents who are out there.
[2:18]This book delivers a simple way to take a look at you as a parent.
[2:22]Your family is a whole.
[2:24]Being able to find out what are the strengths of your family, build a role, a road map
[2:29]on those strengths to be able to get to the places where you need to get a little bit stronger.
[2:34]And it's a simple way to look at everybody as a whole and individual and get to a better
[2:38]place as a whole and really build the value of a family that we've seen to loss over time.
[2:44]So you have a whole section on dealing with our own baggage, which is very interesting
[2:48]because of course, as parents and co-parents and everything, we all enter into parenting
[2:54]with a whole set of preconceived experiences, notions, all of that.
[2:58]How do we navigate our own baggage?
[3:01]And how do we optimize it for potential good things?
[3:05]Well, like you just said, we all have preconceived notions, baggage, whatever.
[3:09]I don't think anybody really takes the time to take a look at that baggage, those notions
[3:13]and the parenting that they want to do.
[3:16]And then there are also probably most cases co-parenting with somebody who has their own
[3:20]set of notions, baggage, et cetera.
[3:22]And when nobody's looking at any of that stuff, you're coming together with unknown stuff
[3:26]and then you're being triggered by children.
[3:29]So when you have a two-year-old, you're going to be triggered in certain ways that are
[3:32]going to trigger things about you when you were to, whether you're aware of it or not.
[3:35]So the more you can do inventory of yourself, the better off it is.
[3:39]And I mean, it sounds really cumbersome to say, well, take inventory and know yourself
[3:44]better as a parent before your parent.
[3:46]And it's a lot of work.
[3:47]But I'm talking about just general things to be able to know the things that really
[3:50]I'm setting.
[3:51]So, you know, most parents say, well, I already know those things.
[3:53]I'm going to do the exact opposite of what my mother and father did.
[3:56]But guess what?
[3:57]That's what leads you right back into doing what they did because you're blind to it.
[4:01]So acknowledging it, understanding it, and really just seeing it will help you prevent
[4:05]from doing things that you don't want to do.
[4:08]And how can everybody in the family fan together to have the same goal, right?
[4:14]Like in analyzing family systems and all of that, obviously everybody wants the best for
[4:18]their kids.
[4:19]But how do you advise actually working through this?
[4:22]Like tactically?
[4:23]Well, I think it starts with the parents, if there's both parents there, they have to come
[4:28]to a place where they can agree on code, you know, code mingle strengths.
[4:33]So list the strengths of each one of you as an individual parent.
[4:37]And the strengths of each one of your children.
[4:39]And then see what the strengths of your family should be built upon.
[4:42]That's the foundation.
[4:43]If you can agree upon that foundation of strengths between the two parents, then that's
[4:47]what you present to your children to build upon.
[4:49]And then allow your children their own individuality of their strengths and stuff.
[4:52]So that everybody has input, but we all agree to disagree, but come together at some point
[4:57]on strengths.
[4:58]Interesting.
[4:59]When I was at the event with Rebecca Fail, somebody was asking a question about their
[5:04]child who couldn't fall asleep and there was so much anxiety and you know, people nicely
[5:09]suggested maybe it was time for that child to see an expert in the field and even potentially
[5:14]medication.
[5:15]How do you feel about how do you advise parents after they've sort of used up all of their
[5:22]own resources in terms of parenting?
[5:24]How do they know when it's time to reach out to an expert when it's time to bring in
[5:30]some reinforcements and how should parents think about that?
[5:34]Well, it's always good to do whatever you think you know to do.
[5:38]You can talk to your co-parent or whatever, but there's nothing wrong with asking your
[5:43]pediatrician or your doctor or somebody that you're close to spiritually or whatever.
[5:48]Always get advice, but do what feels right to you, but at a certain point when it's starting
[5:52]to influence the rest of the family or the actual daily activities of that child because
[5:57]they're not sleeping or it's disrupting the house, then that's assigned to you that
[6:01]there's something deeper going on.
[6:03]Your child can't fall asleep because they're too anxious or they're waking up throughout
[6:06]the night or they can't separate from you and they can sleep in your bed with you.
[6:10]There are issues in that their behavior is telling you, so behavior is what speaks.
[6:15]So if somebody is, if a kid is sleeping in bed with you every night, what should that
[6:20]tell you?
[6:21]Well, it should tell you either you're allowing it because you don't want to be alone
[6:25]with your partner or tell you that your child has separation issues and the best way to get
[6:33]your child to feel good about themselves is no matter how you can do it, carry them back
[6:37]to their bed, even when they're asleep so that they can wake up in their own bed and
[6:41]feel successful.
[6:42]They won't know that they went there 10 minutes before they woke up, they could be their
[6:46]own night, but the feeling of waking up and success is what is the strength that you
[6:50]built upon.
[6:51]Interesting.
[6:52]How did you end up in this field?
[6:54]I ended up in this field because I actually, when I was in med school, I had a job at night
[7:00]and I wasn't able to get to psychiatry class in the morning and I didn't have it.
[7:05]But because of my abs and I had to take it in the summer and I ended up loving it.
[7:12]So it was the, um, oh my gosh, that is so funny.
[7:17]So, but why, why kid, I mean, why this area that's breast psychiatry is so broad.
[7:22]I think because as I went through all of the very variations of rotations in general psychiatry,
[7:28]I really saw that a lot of the childhood stuff that I personally went through because I
[7:32]grew up in Pennsylvania.
[7:33]My dad was a coal miner.
[7:34]We didn't have a whole lot and I struggled a lot and I'm also gay.
[7:39]And so I was gay in a small town with all that other stuff and it was not easy and I struggled
[7:44]and I saw that if I only had somebody to help or talk to, it would have made a huge difference.
[7:49]And as I started to do childhood psychiatry, talking to a child makes such a huge difference
[7:54]and it changed their life that you could change it's life one at a time I wanted to try
[7:59]to do that.
[8:00]Wow.
[8:01]That's beautiful.
[8:02]It's really nice.
[8:03]Do you feel like there's something in, I feel, let me rephrase this.
[8:06]I feel like there's something even just invalidating the feelings that kids have that
[8:10]is gives them such a sense of autonomy and feeling good about themselves and all of that.
[8:15]Like how do you feel?
[8:16]I feel like just being able to focus on, on the kids is so huge, even though a lot of them
[8:23]like say they might not want to do it.
[8:25]So how do you, how do you feel about that and tell me like an example of, of a child
[8:29]that you've been working with who came in feeling one way and left feeling another way
[8:33]and how that felt to you?
[8:35]Well, I think my biggest thing that I tell people all the time is we don't respect
[8:39]child with enough as a daughter and I think children are not, they're not without emotions
[8:46]and intuitions and feelings and so they know when they're not being respected.
[8:51]It doesn't have to take a total violation for them to get it.
[8:55]They know when they're not being treated well or they're being slighted or disrespected.
[8:59]So I think if we start at a place of respecting a child, that's the best place to start
[9:03]and that's what I do.
[9:04]So if I have a child that comes in and I see a kid this week who comes in doesn't want
[9:09]to see me.
[9:10]But I'm not there to tell them, tell them that their parents brought them in, what's your
[9:15]problem?
[9:16]Why are you a problem all that?
[9:17]I just say, tell me why you think you're here, tell me why you don't want to be here
[9:21]and then we talk about everything else but why they're there from music or Google to
[9:25]their friends.
[9:26]It's really about respecting them, letting them know that I'm just not placating them.
[9:30]I'm not trying to buy them and pull them in.
[9:32]I really am interested in who they hang out with, why they hang out with them, why they
[9:35]like that music and just connect on technology and all that kind of stuff.
[9:40]That's why the pipper I can be and connect with them the better and it's building that
[9:45]trust and it may take a month, it may take two months, but I keep telling parents that's
[9:49]money in the bank because when they do have an issue, they're going to come right to me
[9:53]and every single time that's what happens because even years later, I have kids who
[9:57]are now graduating college and...
[10:00]going out into the workforce and they still reach back to me asking me advice or what do you
[10:05]think about this or updating this girl and this is what happened. So it's that trust building
[10:09]and respect that has to start. Wow. So there are tons of psychiatrists out there, obviously,
[10:14]but not everybody ends up sort of collaborating with Dr. Phil and all of that. How did that happen?
[10:20]Like how did you ascend to this sort of level of visibility and all of that?
[10:25]It's honestly nothing that I strived for. I just, again, like psychiatry, I tripped into it,
[10:30]but I think when you have a strength at something and you're guided to something, you just follow it.
[10:35]I had been the medical director for DCFS children services here in Los Angeles and he was
[10:42]struggling with his Britney Spears stuff and he had gone to see her and I think he had come out and
[10:48]talked about her a little bit and the media didn't place that in a very good way in his light
[10:54]and he needed some support through that and he reached out to me. I don't know why. I guess
[10:58]because I was the head of children services and asked me some advice and we became really good
[11:03]friends and over 18 years. We've been best at friends. Oh my gosh. Wow. Yeah. Funny how things
[11:08]happened. These are great, man. That is amazing. And he wrote the forward, which is lovely. Yes.
[11:14]When did you decide to make this into a book? About a year and a half, like about a year
[11:18]before the pandemic, we started talking about it because we were really bothered by the values of
[11:22]families that we were seeing on the show and that people were just losing sight of it. I mean,
[11:26]we were having mothers coming in of divorced families that their daughters were living half-time
[11:31]with them and they were teaching them how to strip with them in the clubs at night and fathers
[11:36]who were upset about it but had no power in it and a daughter who was now caught in between these
[11:40]who kind of house values and stuff like that or kids who were out on the streets and parents
[11:45]didn't care or they were given up on their children. You know, we were just seeing just a grumbling
[11:50]of the foundation of values and then the pandemic hit and it got even worse. So we decided to do
[11:56]something and that's where he's shifting next to as he ends this part of his career he's starting
[12:01]in the department in the night and we're going to start looking at values of families and
[12:05]being out in the field more and doing that kind of stuff. Which explained that a little bit more.
[12:10]That was very big. Was that a mess? No, no, no. The show is done. Yeah. We're going to be moving on
[12:17]to he's going to do a prime time show. Okay. Going to be focused more on family values and
[12:23]how to rebuild family values and how the political scene is maybe eating away at them or people
[12:30]don't realize they're voting for people who are not really supporting the overall family values
[12:34]of our system and you know the things that are important. So that's the kind of stuff we're not building.
[12:40]And how do you deal with parents who have differing views whether they're divorced or married
[12:45]on what they think they should do with the kids? Well, again, it's it's trying to help them both
[12:51]understand because a lot of their own stuff gets in the way. Either they have unresolved issues
[12:55]from their divorce or jealousy or anger or money issues. It's about the best interest of their
[13:00]child. So if they can both be brought to the table to make a decision that's in the best interest
[13:05]of that child, then they're seeing that they have to put themselves aside because what might be
[13:10]right for an angry mom or an angry dad is not going to be best for that child. So focusing on the
[13:14]best interest of a child, which is what we do in child welfare, when we try to place a child,
[13:19]what is in the best interest of that child? Whether we take them out of that home,
[13:22]or we support the parents to become better and stronger, but it's always in the best interest
[13:27]of a child. So you feel like in the process of helping all these other kids in some way you've
[13:33]healed yourself? Absolutely. Yes. And I learn every day more about myself and how to heal myself.
[13:39]And the meaning of things and I value more about the parenting I did get instead of the
[13:44]parenting I thought I didn't get. And I value of love in different ways. That's lovely.
[13:50]So do you think that this will become some sort of series? Did you love writing a book? Is this
[13:56]like your thing? Do you want to have like 10 more books now? Or are you? Yeah. Yes. Yes.
[14:02]Yeah. I'm excited. I mean, I'm also going to do some prime time specials on family values and
[14:07]stuff. So I'm going to do that. I'm going to start my podcast up again with different celebrities
[14:12]that we're going to interview about their families and their family values. So we could start to
[14:15]get it out there about how to build family values, how to shift them, how to strengthen them.
[14:20]And if you don't have them, how to recognize them and build them. I was at some event once and they
[14:25]they had us like go through and circle adjectives that describe our family or like things that
[14:31]are really important to us and then like put them up on the bulletin board, which I guess I did
[14:35]because I still have it like they're underneath like 57 schedules. And I was like, what was that from
[14:40]I know that's just one mechanism of getting everybody literally on the same page. But what do you feel
[14:45]about about exercises like that? Well, I think it's wonderful because when people write things
[14:51]out and see them concretely, it really resonates better with them because it's easy to say,
[14:57]oh, I love my family, my family's crazy, but I love them. But when you really have to sit down and
[15:01]think about adjectives and ways to describe your family and the things that they do for you,
[15:06]feelings wise, it's impactful. And you see it and you can keep it. And as you see, you see it
[15:11]over and over again. And it reinforces it. So I think it's very important.
[15:15]So I live here in New York most of the time. Also in LA, I'm opening a bookstore there this weekend.
[15:21]Actually, yeah, it's in Santa Monica on Montana 11. Okay. So if you need a book. But I am also on the
[15:28]board of the Child Mind Institute here and Dr. Harold Coppowitz is like, you know, the person to call
[15:33]when a New York kid is like having a big issue. Are you the guy in LA? Yeah. Yeah. We have a
[15:38]patient together. You do. Okay. Yeah. Because it's a family that comes with girls in both cities.
[15:44]Okay. Well, people are often asking me for referrals when their children are having issues.
[15:50]Yeah. And there's also so much shame a lot of the time around it. Like, you know, quiet email,
[15:56]like, don't don't tell anyone. But I, you know, I'm so sorry, I asked to bother, but I have an issue.
[16:00]I'm like, it's not a bother. You know, I, it's, it's also debilitating when a child is going
[16:06]through something and you don't know how to help them. Yeah. I mean, that's no matter how much a parent
[16:11]can or can't love or doesn't know how they still love their child. I know that. And they,
[16:15]they are devastated when they cannot help their child and they're suffering in front of them.
[16:19]So yes, I know it's shameful. But the stereotype has to be broken. And that's part of the message
[16:24]that I'd like to get out of it. And how do you, how do you scale all of this? I know obviously
[16:28]there's the book and the show and everything. But do you do any sort of training for other people,
[16:33]you know, on the psychiatry side or is there a special way that you run your practice that's
[16:38]particularly effective that you can, you can get out to communities where they don't have a you or
[16:43]a doctor call puts or whoever. Well, I, um, teaching UCLA in the psychiatry and child psychiatry
[16:49]programs is the training program. So we get it out that way. And then we do community forms
[16:53]I used to do through DCFS and the child welfare system. We go to different communities
[16:58]throughout the LA region. And we do them on a regular basis where we pull the community together
[17:03]and just like lecture on something and then answer a ton of questions. So we still do that. And then
[17:08]my podcast. Awesome. And what is the most important thing? Let's say there's somebody just starting
[17:13]out. They really want to help kids. What's the most important thing in being a child psychiatrist
[17:19]that this that the caregiver must have in treating children?
[17:24]The better sense of themselves and where they came from and why they're doing this, because if
[17:30]they're not doing it for the right reason, they're not going to be effective. They missed the
[17:34]forest or the tree. So understanding themselves as best as they can. Is it the best thing to do?
[17:40]Do you share your story with your patients ever? Like when I was a boy, blah, blah, blah.
[17:44]I do sometimes with certain ones, other ones I don't. But when I need to, I do absolutely.
[17:49]What I share stories about me as a parent with my child, great understanding of worth
[17:53]parents so they understand they're not alone. I, you know, we all share the pain.
[17:59]Wow. Wonderful. Okay. Well, Dr. Sophie, thank you. Family values, reset, trust, boundaries,
[18:05]and connection with your child. I think the work you're doing is really amazing. And it's a good thing
[18:10]that you, you know, miss the original class. Because I think people who have been up, so it's
[18:16]really wonderful. Thank you. Have a safe trip and up to LA. Thank you. Okay. Bye bye. Bye bye.
[18:23]Thanks for listening to this episode of Moms Don't Have Time to Read Books. Don't forget to
[18:27]follow me on Instagram at zebi Owens and at Moms Don't Have Time to Read Books. Also sign
[18:32]up for my newsletter at zebiowens.com and sign up for my virtual book club and meet lots of authors
[18:37]on Zoom every other week. Thanks so much to Steve and Ryan. In fact, texture sound for the sound editing.
[18:43]And thank you to Morning Moon Productions for providing this fantastic intro and
[18:46]now trim music.