Dina Alvarez & Dina Aronson, MIDLIFE PRIVATE PARTS: Revealing Essays that Will Change the Way You Think About Age
[0:00]Hi, this is Zibi Owens, and you're listening to Totally Book to Zibi.
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[0:45]Welcome back to Totally Booked Live, so excited to be here.
[0:49]We have such an amazing show today.
[0:52]We have not only Dina Alvarez and Dina Aronson, the co-editors of mid-life private
[0:58]parts, revealing essays that will change the way you think about age, which I definitely
[1:03]need myself, and have rethought my own thoughts a million times, but we have a number
[1:07]of the contributors to this fabulous anthology.
[1:11]By the way, I am one of the contributors, not to toot my own horn, but anyway, so we'll
[1:16]start with reading a little bit about the two of you, and then we'll hear from some of
[1:21]the contributors.
[1:22]I'm so excited.
[1:23]Welcome, by the way.
[1:24]Thank you.
[1:25]Thank you for having us.
[1:26]Thank you.
[1:27]It is my pleasure.
[1:29]OK.
[1:30]Raise your hand if your name is Dina Alvarez.
[1:32]OK, great.
[1:33]Dina Alvarez started her writing career as a freelancer for a big Apple parent in New York
[1:37]City, covering education, local politics, and lifestyle.
[1:42]She later co-founded So Most Padres, the first and only bilingual parenting publication
[1:47]for Hispanic families in New York City.
[1:49]Dina continues to write in her spare time with a focus on creative nonfiction pieces.
[1:54]She is an avid reader and lover of anthologies, particularly those that tell women's stories.
[2:00]Dina is the mother of two adult sons and a native New Yorker.
[2:03]She continues to call the city home where she lives with her husband.
[2:07]Yay.
[2:08]Welcome, Dina Alvarez.
[2:09]Also, Dina Aronson is passionate about shining a light on midlife women and reframing
[2:15]the cultural conversation around aging.
[2:18]She began her career as an attorney later founding a legal search firm, but pivoted as
[2:22]she approached midlife and couldn't find relevant content that reflected her experience.
[2:28]She began freelancing for startups, aimed at the 40 plus woman, and founded the Bettina
[2:33]blog.
[2:34]Now a sub-stack newsletter called Bettina with Dina Aronson, where she explores topics
[2:38]in and around aging through her midlife lens.
[2:41]Speaking of midlife lenses, I am wearing my kattice readers, which I am obsessed with,
[2:46]and they have gifted you all kattice as well.
[2:48]She has two grown step sons and currently resides between New York City and Miami with
[2:53]her husband, who I just met, and is here as well.
[2:57]So welcome, Dina.
[2:58]Thank you for coming.
[2:59]Thank you.
[3:00]You did it.
[3:01]I did it.
[3:02]Didn't fall over.
[3:03]Very exciting.
[3:04]Okay.
[3:05]Before I bring everybody else on, just give an overview of the book and how it came
[3:11]to be.
[3:12]Okay.
[3:13]Well, the book is a collection of incredible stories, some of which are from these women.
[3:20]And it came to be because Dina and I came, we actually came together later in life.
[3:25]We met in our 50s, in our early 50s, and we just had an instant connection, and Dina
[3:31]had an idea for an anthology that was a little bit different than this one.
[3:34]And I was sort of steeped in midlife, as you know, you just read about the blog, and I started
[3:39]that because there wasn't enough content that reflected what was happening in our lives.
[3:43]And so we came to this idea of why not tell these stories.
[3:48]You know, the narrative is so outdated and just wrong.
[3:52]So let's rewrite it.
[3:54]And so we started to, you know, we were creating community and it was pandemic time.
[4:00]So a lot of us were online and meeting each other.
[4:03]And we connected with the most incredible women.
[4:05]And we just started reaching out and saying, hey, this, we think this is really important.
[4:10]And we'd love for you to come along and tell your stories and, you know, let's share
[4:14]so that we can start to ship this conversation.
[4:16]And I think, you know, more personally, it's just such a, it can be such a lonely time.
[4:23]There's so much changing.
[4:24]There's, you know, relational shifts and physical shifts and emotional shifts and it can
[4:27]leave us feeling so unhinged.
[4:30]And I know I have thought that way.
[4:31]And so we also want women to know like they're not alone on this journey.
[4:36]And that, even though it doesn't feel anything approaching normal, it's normal.
[4:40]So that, that's sort of the idea and I'll let Dina jump in.
[4:44]Well, the anthology was definitely born of a midlife friendship.
[4:48]Two women who came together with similar values and ideas and love to write.
[4:53]And I also felt that, you know, we, we have a part in the book.
[4:56]I think it's the beginning where it says type in the word midlife in any Google search engine
[5:01]and the word crisis will come up.
[5:03]But the world we were living in at the moment, women were not having a crisis at all.
[5:08]In fact, they were going out and starting podcasts and, you know, placing in the top 1%.
[5:13]They were becoming jewelry designers or creating other new endeavors.
[5:17]We have a writer who started a woman's health product.
[5:21]We had all these women around us.
[5:23]None of them were having a crisis and they had great stories to tell.
[5:27]Is life perfect?
[5:28]Absolutely not.
[5:29]But there is always a silver lining and almost anything if you look for it.
[5:32]And I think that's what we wanted to help other women see that midlife is not a time
[5:37]to be afraid of.
[5:38]You know, we're sold this idea that, you know, aging and getting older is, you know,
[5:42]something to fear.
[5:43]When in fact, I had the very opposite experience.
[5:46]I felt like a sense of freedom and curiosity and I'm wanting to do a new project.
[5:52]So it's also a way to show younger women if they pick up the book and read it that there
[5:56]are a lot of great opportunities out there and that you can learn from the women who are
[6:00]already there.
[6:02]So that was really the reason we wanted to work together to kind of pool our resources
[6:07]and give other women the opportunity to feel seen, heard and understood, which I think
[6:12]many of us aren't.
[6:15]And it's just been a wonderful project and I'm thrilled to have all these wonderful women
[6:19]contribute who you'll hear from in about 30 seconds.
[6:22]Amazing.
[6:23]Well, having read the whole collection, I not only felt understood, but totally inspired.
[6:29]And also just really energized to be part of a group of people who are creative and
[6:34]maybe have a little extra time to do the things they always wanted to do, not in the weeds
[6:39]of the parenting years or whatever, but this opportunity to do what's next, which can
[6:45]feel depressing and overwhelming, but exciting.
[6:49]So on that note, we'll start having our contributors one at a time come sit here.
[6:55]So come on over and if you don't mind, just share your name and what your story is about.
[7:00]Sure.
[7:01]Thank you.
[7:02]My name is Laura Friedman Williams and my story is about sex in midlife.
[7:09]It was actually born out of crisis.
[7:11]So I would say midlife crisis was forced on me.
[7:14]I don't think I would have entered it on my own, but who knows.
[7:18]When my husband had an affair and my very long marriage entered and I was single for the
[7:22]first time in my late 40s, it had been since I was like 19 that I had been single.
[7:27]And I went on a sexual journey and really rediscovered intimacy and sexuality and myself.
[7:35]And I gained so much power through it.
[7:38]I learned so much about myself, but also really it gave me a voice.
[7:44]It just gave me a voice again.
[7:45]It helped me find my way.
[7:46]I think a lot of people felt that I was just sleeping around and there was some of that
[7:51]and that was fun.
[7:52]I mean, there's nothing like having fun again after your heart's been broken.
[7:56]So I have no shame about that actually.
[7:59]I feel like people should just all be having more sex.
[8:02]And then I...
[8:03]And that's a wrap.
[8:04]It's gotten what we needed out of today, don't you?
[8:10]And then I wrote a book about it.
[8:11]And so I think the sex gave me a voice and then the voice gave me a book.
[8:17]Amazing.
[8:18]Thank you so much.
[8:19]Try to top that.
[8:20]I don't want to be the one following the sexual journey.
[8:26]Okay.
[8:27]I'm Jessica Fine.
[8:29]And my story is about shifting perspectives and it's about the realization I came to sometime
[8:36]after 50 that what I had envisioned post 50 being like was absolutely the inverse.
[8:44]I had always thought like your 20s, your 30s, you're figuring out who you are, what
[8:48]you believe in, you're like testing, experimenting.
[8:51]And then by the time you creep up in age, you got it.
[8:55]Like that's when you know everything you believe in and you're just done and you can stand
[8:59]firm in who you are, what you believe, all that kind of stuff.
[9:04]And what I realized is once you get to a certain point and for me it was post 50, it's
[9:10]all wide open.
[9:11]You...
[9:12]There are no more shoulds.
[9:13]There's no more, you know, this is who I am because this is who my parents were or this
[9:18]is who I am because this is what I was raised to be.
[9:20]It's now we can be who we want to be, we can explore and we can experiment and it's
[9:26]just for me been much more of an open, invigorating, inspiring, exciting time than I thought
[9:32]it would be.
[9:33]The essay I give specific examples, but that's the general thing.
[9:38]And I might be mixing this up, but weren't you saying that you now wear string bikinis
[9:44]or string bikinis is a little bit of an exaggeration, but maybe since I followed the
[9:48]sexual journey, we can just leave it up, yes, I wish some bikinis.
[9:53]But I do appreciate your shout out to the glasses because that is part of my essay is that
[9:58]I am known to wear.
[10:00]More than one pair of glasses at the same time.
[10:03]Yeah, I was interested when you said you wear
[10:06]distance glasses and reading glasses,
[10:07]because now in the car, I'm trying to see the things
[10:10]that are closed, but then the road, and I'm telling you,
[10:12]just put one pair on top of the other,
[10:14]and you will be all set.
[10:15]Oh, boy.
[10:16]Yeah.
[10:16]It's a good look.
[10:17]Anyway, thanks to it.
[10:19]That was the first essay in the collection, by the way.
[10:21]So it kicks it off with a great new point of view.
[10:24]Hi.
[10:25]Hi.
[10:26]Hello.
[10:27]I am Skydity of its heroes.
[10:29]And my essay is about all day I want to briefly.
[10:33]And it's about the mental load that we carry as women
[10:37]and how in midlife, as we start to visibly age,
[10:42]we often feel this sense of not being seen
[10:45]and becoming invisible to society.
[10:48]And it's really about the conflict that exists in that space.
[10:52]So for me personally, I feel that at 50,
[10:56]I am becoming more confident in so many ways.
[10:59]And this is at the exact same time that society is telling me
[11:03]that my value is diminishing.
[11:05]And my worth is decreasing.
[11:06]And so it's really about what it takes on a daily basis
[11:13]to navigate that, because as women in midlife,
[11:17]we have this kind of unique vantage point
[11:19]of the wisdom that we've acquired over the years.
[11:22]But then, again, there's uncertainty that, you know,
[11:26]what does the future hold?
[11:28]And yeah, it's a lot.
[11:30]And when I whittled it down to what I think about on a daily basis,
[11:34]I was like, no wonder we are walking
[11:37]around exhausted day and day now.
[11:39]It is so much to carry.
[11:41]So I wanted to give some insight into that,
[11:44]because I think that this often feels
[11:47]like a very isolating time for women.
[11:49]And I just want them to know that they're not alone.
[11:52]There's so many of us that are trying
[11:53]to figure all of this out.
[11:55]And I am also somebody who wears two pairs of glasses
[11:58]at the same time.
[12:00]So yeah, I can identify with a lot of the shares
[12:04]that I've heard.
[12:05]So I hope that other women will find that that sense of warmth,
[12:08]community, understanding, and solidarity as well.
[12:12]I love that.
[12:13]And it's not even just that everyone is sharing,
[12:15]like what you shared in your essay.
[12:17]But the writing of the essays is also such high quality.
[12:21]I mean, these are really beautiful essays,
[12:24]not just quickly dashed off sort of bloggy type posts.
[12:28]These are beautiful essays, which we're
[12:30]a joy to read like yours.
[12:32]So thank you.
[12:32]Thank you.
[12:34]Next up, hello.
[12:36]Hi.
[12:37]My name is Julie Flakstad.
[12:39]I'm excited to be here with you all.
[12:41]My essay is about shifting identities.
[12:45]It's really about the duality of aging.
[12:48]And I believe passionately that there is a duality.
[12:52]There is this morning in loss that is coupled
[12:56]with curiosity, growth, inspiration.
[12:58]But there are two sides of the coin.
[13:01]And in the work that I do, I really,
[13:03]I don't think you can have one without the other.
[13:06]So the essay explores exactly that of looking back
[13:11]at one's life and realizing all the moments
[13:16]with children, with motherhood, with marriage,
[13:18]with friendship, and kind of taking a look back.
[13:22]And then also taking a look forward about what's ahead.
[13:25]And realizing the essay actually takes
[13:28]place with me watching my elderly neighbors
[13:31]move into a retirement home.
[13:35]And in watching their move happen over the course
[13:39]of several weeks, it gave me an opportunity
[13:42]to reflect and pause about where I was at this pivotal moment
[13:45]in my life.
[13:47]And it was a teary few weeks.
[13:50]But it really also set me up for everything
[13:52]that was ahead and making sure that I lived in the moment
[13:55]for the second act that we're all approaching.
[13:58]I love that essay so much.
[14:00]And how you were like, wait, how am I the oldest person
[14:03]on my street?
[14:04]You're like, when did that happen?
[14:07]It was exactly.
[14:08]And little kind of footnote on that.
[14:09]So that a young couple moved into that house.
[14:12]And they have a three-year-old and a one-year-old,
[14:14]which was exactly the age I was when I moved into my house.
[14:17]So it's kind of this, it's really wonderful how
[14:19]the circle of life continues.
[14:21]So anyway, congratulations to everybody.
[14:23]Thank you.
[14:24]Hi.
[14:25]Hi, everyone.
[14:26]My name is Katie Fogarty.
[14:28]My essay opens with me looking at my husband of 20-plus years
[14:33]and shouting, I want a divorce in the middle of our driveway
[14:36]during the middle of a pandemic.
[14:38]And spoiler, we're still married.
[14:41]We managed to work it out.
[14:42]But my essay is really about, like, how did I get here?
[14:45]How did I get in this towering state of rage,
[14:48]looking at somebody that I love so deeply
[14:50]and saying, like, I'm at a breaking point.
[14:53]And so the essay explores, like, Perry Menopause,
[14:57]the pandemic, sheltering place with everyone
[15:00]I gave birth to, the sort of hothouse of emotions,
[15:03]and then the launch of my podcast, a certain age, which
[15:06]is how I'm first connected to Zibi.
[15:10]And the podcast set me in rooms exactly like this,
[15:14]talking to women in midlife, hearing their stories,
[15:17]and learning.
[15:18]I was very far from alone in this moment of overwhelm,
[15:22]and how did I exactly get to this phase of my life?
[15:25]And so the essay, I think, invites people
[15:28]to explore that for themselves.
[15:31]Amazing.
[15:31]And there's some sex, and yours as well.
[15:34]Yes.
[15:35]Yeah.
[15:36]Of course, that's why we're still married, wouldn't you?
[15:39]Some specific tips.
[15:41]But we'll leave that to the essay.
[15:43]So it's a wonderful collection.
[15:45]I can't wait for it to be out in the world.
[15:47]And I want to thank the dean of this for organizing it
[15:49]and bringing us all together.
[15:50]And for Zibi for always amplifying the stories of people
[15:54]and now amplifying the stories of midlife women.
[15:56]Because we will not be aging quietly.
[15:59]Thank you.
[15:59]Thank you.
[16:01]Hi, my dean of Zibi.
[16:04]Hi, everybody.
[16:05]My name is Laura Belgrade.
[16:07]And well, my essay, I too have been on a journey.
[16:11]It's not a sexy.
[16:12]It is a leisure journey as in dermatological.
[16:16]Lasers, microneedling, everything
[16:19]having to do with the jawline and the neck.
[16:24]And we'll say that when I was on Katie's podcast,
[16:28]she ends with a fill in the blank as I age, I feel.
[16:34]And I was like, something empowering, something empowering.
[16:38]Bad about my neck.
[16:42]So my essay is called Mysterious Charge.
[16:45]And it opens with my husband going over our Amics Bill
[16:50]and me praying that he doesn't notice the big fat charge
[16:53]from the dermatologist.
[16:55]And it really deals with the ideas of aging,
[16:59]what it means to age gracefully in our culture
[17:04]and the duality of that.
[17:06]Thank you for that word.
[17:07]Because we are supposed to keep it up, maintain, look
[17:12]great age gracefully, but not look like we've had anything
[17:16]done.
[17:17]We're just basically supposed to have Polina Porosco
[17:20]of his bone structure.
[17:22]And that's what's expected of us as women as we age.
[17:25]So it deals with just the hope and the shame
[17:31]and the hiding of stuff that I've had done
[17:34]and hoping that it works and hoping it's not
[17:39]discovered and lying a little bit about a difference.
[17:43]Is there one thing you've had done
[17:44]that you would recommend that we all do?
[17:47]Oh, yes.
[17:48]OK.
[17:49]At the first time, don't wait till you're,
[17:52]and it's not my fault that I waited.
[17:53]They didn't have this technology yet.
[17:56]But I would say, don't wait till you see creepiness
[17:59]at the first sign of it, or even before.
[18:03]Get soft wave done.
[18:04]I think not everyone's a candidate.
[18:07]I think it depends on how much melon you have.
[18:10]But that kind of laser it tightens.
[18:13]And I think that it's going to do what I need it to do
[18:18]and not have to go under the knife.
[18:20]No one has to go under the knife,
[18:22]but to achieve what I want, I think there are advances
[18:27]so that we don't have to have face lifts if we want a certain
[18:31]look.
[18:32]Today's episode has been sponsored by such waves.
[18:36]Seriously, I want to invest in it.
[18:39]Created by Israeli's good stuff.
[18:41]Great.
[18:42]Amazing.
[18:43]Maybe they'll get a discount.
[18:45]Exactly.
[18:47]Thank you for it.
[18:48]Hi.
[18:49]I'm Marian Adams.
[18:51]I am so honored to be part of this beautiful collaboration.
[18:54]Full heart.
[18:56]I wrote an essay about my three-year medical gas lighting
[19:01]menopause experience.
[19:04]I recently turned 60, and it's the best.
[19:07]But in 2015, when I was 52, I started to not feel like myself.
[19:12]My hair started to fall out.
[19:14]I had torturous insomnia.
[19:16]I had crippling fatigue.
[19:19]I couldn't concentrate or focus.
[19:22]I was falling apart.
[19:24]And so for over three years, I saw 10 doctors.
[19:29]Many of them said my debilitating symptoms
[19:32]pardon me were in my head, likely from a chemical imbalance
[19:35]in my brain, for which there's no test for that, by the way.
[19:39]It's only diagnosed by conversation.
[19:40]There's no scan.
[19:41]There's no blood test.
[19:42]So I believed it, because I was definitely not myself.
[19:46]So I saw two internists, two OB-GYNs, four psychiatrists,
[19:51]one Ayurvedic doctor, and one neurologist.
[19:55]And after about 22 into depressants.
[20:00]Two week hospitalization, 36 rounds of trans cranial magnetic stimulation, I was basically a
[20:09]catatonic recluse. I felt like I was just a vessel that just needed calories. But my personality,
[20:16]my joy, my spirit was just gone. And in the beginning of this year, three years, I couldn't stop crying.
[20:24]And at the end of it, I couldn't cry. I just couldn't even cry. I was just sort of
[20:31]void. And some people said, well, maybe it's not depression. Maybe you're sad because you don't have
[20:37]small children to care for anymore. Maybe you should get a job. Another doctor said, you can't be that
[20:43]bad. You're wearing your pearls and your hair looks nice. Sort of just very condescending, dismissive
[20:49]things. And this old was in New York City in Long Island. But not too far from here, Dr. number 11,
[20:57]my angel saved my life, Dr. Caroline Isira. She's an internist and a neurologist. I thought she
[21:03]was a nutritionist. And I went to her to make some food ideas to make me feel better. And she turned
[21:10]listened to my history. She looked at me. She heard me. And she said to the nurse, I went the following
[21:17]thyroid estrogen, progesterone, testosterone, vitamin B, vitamin D, and Epstein bar. Two days later,
[21:25]she turned over the results. And she said, Mary, the reason none of the treatments or
[21:31]medications you took to help you is because they target a chemical imbalance in the brain.
[21:36]That is not what caused your symptoms. You haven't slept in three years because you have no
[21:40]progesterone. You can't stop crying or feel like yourself or do anything. Have any energy because
[21:45]you have no estrogen or testosterone, which women need to. Your vitamin D is completely depleted,
[21:52]your vitamin B is completely depleted, and you did have the Epstein bar virus at one point.
[21:58]Those are seven different things, one of which would put you on the couch. So swiftly, very swiftly,
[22:06]probably within about two weeks after I started a biodenicle, a hormone cream rubbed in on my
[22:13]little wrist, thyroid medication, prescription to sprained vitamin D. Once a week, 50,000 units,
[22:20]that's the key for that. And a daily vitamin B. And I started to come back to life. It was a miracle.
[22:28]I really felt like I rose in the dead. So I was determined to write an essay for one reason,
[22:34]so that women can avoid unnecessary preventable suffering and learn the lessons that I learned.
[22:41]And I guess that what I would leave them with would be one, if you don't feel right, you're not
[22:46]right. Depression is a symptom, not a diagnosis. And then finally, if treatment for a condition
[22:55]is not working, it might be time to question the diagnosis. So that was what I wanted to share.
[23:01]And if it helped one person, and 99 said you're crazy or you're dumb, I would say, that's okay,
[23:06]so long as one person, you know, benefit from it. So I'm just so grateful. Great job.
[23:11]Thank you. You're essay was so good. Thank you. So good. Especially, you were like,
[23:15]I just wish I could get that time back with my family, those months and years that were just lost
[23:21]to misdiagnosis. Yeah, that was a tough one. But in the end, I now feel like one of the lucky ones,
[23:26]because I think got goodness knows how many women, you know, so many women struggle. So thank you,
[23:33]lovely to see you. And of course, both of you also wrote essays. Can you share what those are?
[23:38]So my essay is titled The Not So Invisible Woman, because I've had a very interesting later in
[23:45]life experience. I was a severe introvert when I was younger and very shy. And so I kind of,
[23:52]there's a line where I say, I've worn an invisibility cloak my whole life. But somehow I got to 50,
[23:58]and it was like this switch went off. And I suddenly felt very different. And I felt very
[24:03]seen. And I felt that the people that needed to see me were the right people. And I was in the right
[24:08]place. And, you know, this book was born of that experience also, feeling like I had finally
[24:14]come into myself. And the chapter title is Can You See Me Now? But I could have easily gone into a
[24:20]chapter called Late Bloomer, because I'm not quite sure which one of those would fit.
[24:25]But I do feel very seen. And I feel empowered. And I feel confident. And it's something I never
[24:31]had when I was younger. So I feel like I've lived my life in reverse in a way. And I don't think
[24:36]that's a terrible thing. I actually am very appreciative of it. And so if you asked me what age I
[24:42]would go back to, I would say none. This is it. This is where I want to be. I feel comfortable and
[24:47]confident and excited. And I think this was also a catalyst to the book as well, putting, you know,
[24:53]creating a project that could give me a little space to be creative and also share other stories.
[25:00]That maybe you don't feel invisible, but you have other things going on that I'm also experiencing.
[25:04]And they say read the book, write the book you want to read. So that was another thing. But
[25:08]yeah, so I'm no longer invisible. I feel great at midlife. And I hope that other women, you know,
[25:14]if they're feeling that way, I hope that they get there. And I think part of it is just putting
[25:18]yourself in the right places with the right people in the right communities. And you will feel seen.
[25:24]It's my piece of definitely seeing you today. Yeah. And my essay was born of the loss of my mom,
[25:33]part of me. It's called Flying Motherless. Because I wrote it on a plane on the anniversary,
[25:38]the second anniversary of my second anniversary, I think of my mom's death. But also was a big
[25:44]catalyst for this book. Because when my mom died, she left space. And I felt very compelled to use
[25:53]that space to create something beautiful and meaningful and something that would honor her. And so
[25:58]in my story, I talk about how, you know, I almost lost my mom when I was much younger. And so
[26:03]I thought it was interesting to examine sort of the idea of losing her then and actually losing
[26:08]her when I did. And I talk about how I was really as rational a person as I am. It was very
[26:13]prone to magical thinking when it came to my mom. She was never going to die. Obviously that's
[26:20]we all die. But I don't know what my life would have been like if I had lost her at 21. And it was
[26:27]still such a struggle when I did lose her. Just three years or just a little under three years ago.
[26:33]So I think the learning for me and as I was writing that was like the idea that you can
[26:39]hold joy and sorrow in the same hands. And I think too that facing what was my biggest fear
[26:49]losing her in some very ironic way helped me to let go of fear. Although I was a little afraid coming
[26:55]up here today. Okay. But I just, so it was really such a learning experience. And I really am so
[27:07]grateful that I was able to find a way to use that space to honor her. And you heard these stories.
[27:14]I mean it's just, it's like an embarrassment of riches with these women. So I think the
[27:21]message for me and what I want to convey is that as we move into midlife we all experience loss
[27:27]and grief. And I think it's really important to find ways to be present in it to feel it.
[27:33]And, you know, to know that it's okay and life will go on because the world keeps spinning and
[27:40]you need to find a way to be in it. And so I just, I just want people to know that you can find joy
[27:45]and there's joy everywhere when you're present and you're open to, you know, you open your eyes.
[27:49]It's all around. So I love in your essay how you were like, I'm 56, but I still just lost my mom.
[27:54]Yeah. Like it doesn't make it any easier just because we're older to lose people just because it's
[28:00]the natural order of things to make it less sad. So I think giving people that permission to
[28:06]grieve is so important. I also wrote an essay in this book which now that I heard all the other
[28:12]essays I'm like completely embarrassed by my essay but it was a quick thing. I dashed off one
[28:20]morning when my older kids were at boarding school, my two little kids were with their dad that day
[28:26]and I was walking the dog on the street and watching all the other kids get on the bus.
[28:30]And just like feeling like I didn't want to go back up to my apartment because it was just so
[28:35]quiet and I wanted to stay there with all the school kids and I was just mourning sort of the
[28:42]transition of my all my kids fleeing the nest and wondering what's next. Even though I'm happy
[28:49]it's still so sad. So that was what my essay was about. So as you can see this book is
[28:54]chock full of amazing stories and I think everyone who contributed could have written another 50
[28:59]stories and I'm sure everybody else could. I think you guys need to have some sort of summit where
[29:05]there are panels all divided by the sections in your book where people talk about these issues all
[29:10]day because we have so little time and we could talk about this all day and all feel so much better.
[29:16]So thank you for aggregating all the voices. Thank you for coming today midlife private parts.
[29:20]Thank you so much. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you for listening to
[29:26]Totally booked with Zibi, formerly momstone have time to read books. If you loved the show,
[29:31]tell a friend, leave a review, follow me on Instagram at Zibi Owens and spread the word.
[29:38]Thanks so much. Go and buy the books.