Sarah Gelman, Amazon's "Best Books of the Year"

[1:21]Zibby Owens: Hi. This is Zibby Owens, and you're listening to Totally Booked with Zibby. Formerly, moms don't have time to read books. In my daily show, I interview today's latest, best selling, buzziest, or underrated authors and story creators whose work I think is worth your time. As a bookstore owner, publisher, author, and obviously podcaster, I get a comprehensive look at everything that's coming out and spend my time curating the best books so you don't have to. Stay in the know, get insider insights, and connect with guests like I do every single day. For more information, go to zibbymedia.com and follow me on Instagram at zibby owens. Sarah Gellman is the editorial director for books at Amazon. We're talking today about Amazon's best books of the year. Named after the memoir her father was reading when she was born, Sarah was destined for a career in books. She started as a book publicist in New York before relocating to Seattle to work at Amazon. Known for her guest appearances on national talk shows and her signature book club, Sarah Selects, which by the way has picked so many of the books that we have here on the podcast. Sarah loves fiction, memoirs, and a good multigenerational family saga. When she's not working or reading, she is spending time with her two young sons walking her anxious and lovable dog or designing the perfect reading nook. Welcome, Sarah. Thanks so much for coming back on Totally Booked. I can't wait to discuss your Amazon best books of the year 2025, your most anticipated,

[2:55]Sarah Gelman: and books in general. So exciting. Thank you for having me. I love to talk about books with you. I have to say your recent picks every one after another after another. I'm like, yep. Me too. Yep. Love that. Love that. I feel like we are on the same page in a lot of our picks. I love it when you look at someone else's best of list and it's like, oh, yeah. Because sometimes I look at them and I'm like, I don't know. This just isn't my taste, but it's someone's taste. But we really want our list to be something that people look at and they recognize some books like I don't want it to be totally esoteric. Then also you see the books. You're like, Okay, I've heard of the correspondent, so I'm going to try this other book too, because this feels like a list I would like. So we're purposeful about that. We don't need these to be books that people have never heard of before.

[3:40]Zibby Owens: Okay. There we go. Although some yeah. I mean yeah. I was gonna say Both. They should be both. They should be both. A nice mix. A nice mix. A mix. A nice mix. The correspondent nobody had heard of at the beginning.

[3:53]Sarah Gelman: I know. It became a sleeper hit. Missed it too. It's such a funny story how we came to discover it. Obviously, there was word-of-mouth, but you probably have this in your job. It's really hard to go back and read something once you've kind of missed it in your reading time period. So we had missed it and our colleague Vanessa, who had retired this year and moved back to Ireland where she's from to be closer to her family, had texted us. I mean, we'd like, we can't stop talking about books. And she texted us and she said, you all need to read the correspondent. It's so good. And so we read it and it's number two. Not to, you know, ruin anything, but it's number two. Amazing.

[4:31]Zibby Owens: No. I had her on my podcast, and she was on my most anticipated list. And I remember she came here and, like, stood up in front of everyone. She's like, you guys, like, this is my first book. I'm so nervous. And now I feel so much better that you're here. And now it's like she's, like, blown everybody out of the water. It's amazing. Love It's this

[4:47]Sarah Gelman: also a genius move to have letters to an author like Anne Patchett who has such a great platform in your book because then you feel like, oh, she's going to get it. She's going to read it. Yep. And if she likes it, hopefully, she'll talk about it. So it is. It's sort of a brilliant move. Yeah. A 100%. Well, let's go through your list. Let's start with I know. Let let's just we could just keep talking about this stuff, but, yes, let's do the list. It's true. And I haven't read I have not read a a lot all of these. But Okay. Well, tell me which ones you have. Okay. Well, let's go through so everybody knows. So number 10, have The Loneliness of Sonia and Sunny by Kiran Desai. Talk about it. Yes. So this is an epic novel. It's one of those novels that is crossing continents. I mean, really, will say not centuries, but generations. And the main characters are Sonia and Sunny. They are two Indian young adults who both live in America and then both end up back in India. Their parents are sort of at the base trying to set them up. And they, without knowing each other, they say no. And then their lives intersect in an interesting way. And it's, I think, you know, it's a lot of about the sort of isolation and loneliness that you feel as a young adult as you move into like the phase of life where you're just becoming your own person and separate from your family. Then there's the added separateness of being in a different country. I mean, it's just such a great book about families too. I love reading about dysfunctional and funny families. So I think anyone that has interesting characters in their family will love this book. I'm sure most people would say there is an interesting character or two in their family.

[6:25]Zibby Owens: And also, wait, maybe we should back up. So these are the books chosen by the Amazon editors, but Sarah Selects is your book club chosen by you. Is that the correct distinction?

[6:34]Sarah Gelman: That's correct. So this these are our top. We're doing the top 10 books. We have a list of 100 top books for 2025. These are the books published in 2025 that the Amazon editors have read and loved and we think customers will love. This is not based on sales. We actually read the books before they're on sale. So a lot of these books we voted on and no one had purchased them yet. This is really books that we love and we think that everyone should read. Amazing. Okay. Number nine, you have Replaceable You by Mary Roach. Okay. So Mary Roach is well known as this sort of not sort of. She's a very funny science writer. And in this book, she is taking on this phenomenon of, replaceable body parts for lack of a better term. And looking back in the way that people used to use masticators, an actual wrench or something to chew up food before they put it in their mouth because their teeth were not strong enough. And then moving on to dentures and then moving on to you know it sort of walks through all of these ways that overtime we have replaced our body parts and ask questions like is it better to cut off a limb and have a prosthetic or just not have that limb be functioning? But she does it in such a way that is so funny. I think if you are someone who's sort of non fiction curious, but you mostly read fiction, this is Mary Roach is a great way to kind of dive in, put your toe in the water, and see if you like nonfiction because she is she makes everything funny.

[8:07]Zibby Owens: Love that. Atmosphere by Taylor Jenkins Reid.

[8:11]Sarah Gelman: Okay. So Taylor Jenkins Reid, obviously people know her by now. I think she's probably most well known for the husbands of Evelyn Hugo at this point. But the thing that I think is super cool about her is if you look back at her books, I wanna say starting with Evelyn Hugo, they take a powerful woman in each century. And so there's 70s 80s 90s and so the powerful woman or women in this are astronauts And it's about centered on two women in NASA who are dealing with, yes, the challenges of being an astronaut, but also the challenges of being a female astronaut. And then there is a untraditional love story as part of it. And the book starts with a chapter that will have your heart racing and then it goes back in time. So it's almost like a thriller too. You can definitely see it. I mean, not to sound cheesy, it's very atmospheric. In that you could imagine it being a movie. She writes characters so well. She writes love so well. It's just one of those intensely readable books. Amazing. Okay. Awake by Jen Hatmaker. I am obsessed with this book. Me too. Okay. I really actually want to talk to you about this book, and I know we are both divorced women. Yep. And I I love that divorce memoirs are having a moment right now and that women are kind of taking back this narrative and their voice and her story is. Mean the book opens as you know with her waking up to her husband of twenty six years voice texting another woman saying I just can't quit you and I mean that's the line from Brokeback Mountain. At that point she should have been like bye bye. Sorry, that was probably unkind. No, no, no, no, good. All about how she, I mean she was broken. Know, he shattered their life together, this beautiful life that they had built and a public life at that. And she picked herself back up and became a better version of herself. And I listened to this on audio. She reads the audio version. It is so powerful to listen to her read it because you hear the emotion in her voice. You know, she gets choked up. I I'm in the car and I was like, you know, the sort of like choking up voice. But, yeah, it's ultimately really uplifting and

[10:25]Zibby Owens: just empowering for women and I love that. And she's just she's so funny too. She is. She's funny, and she just puts it all out there. And for me, I feel like it was one of the most authentic descriptions of the

[10:40]Sarah Gelman: immediacy of pain when something terrible happens. Like, all the thoughts that you're just like, oh my gosh, and the shock and all of it, like, we were so in it with her that Yeah. I I just, like, couldn't put it down. And you're, like, rooting for her and you know? Yeah. And also, love that her family and friends are so wonderful. Like, this bad thing happens to her, she but has this incredible support network which just makes you feel like you can get through anything with an incredible support network. I remember her saying at one point in there, you know, writing a moment in the book that when she was younger she felt I think it was safe and cherished And I thought, like, that's what I want my children to say when they grow up, that they feel that they their childhood, they felt safe and cherished. Like, that's I love it. I think the best thing you can give a child. I was also struck by her close relationship with her adult siblings and how they came to her aid and, like, oh my gosh. There's just so many so many. Anyway. Okay. The next one, The Intruder by Freda McFadden. Okay. So confession, I had never read Freda McFadden before I read The Intruder. And I sort of thought popcorn thriller, this is gonna be fun. It was. It was very fun. It was very fast paced, but it had a lot of darker and more serious themes and the way that she brought this story together. It's told from the point of view of two different characters and it's very surprising and it is surprising up until the end of the book. Like we often say like she stuck the landing and she stuck the landing a 100%. So this is a very fun,

[12:08]Zibby Owens: but also I think surprising thriller and the premise of a woman alone in a cabin in the woods is just scary, I think. Totally. That's why I'm never going to a cabin. Yeah. By yourself. Just don't go by yourself. I just interviewed this week Paul Fieg, who is the producer director of The Housemaid, which is coming out soon. Oh my gosh. That looks so good. Yeah. I have to say, I went after I read The Intruder, I went back and read The Housemaid. Yep. And it just and then the the trailer, love what I'm tasting. Sorry about my dogs. They they bark sometimes. I can't even hear them. Okay. Good. There you go. No. And the movie was the movie was really fun and not there were some differences with the book and the movie, but, anyway, exciting that that is coming down the pike too. Okay. Number five, also loved Wild Dark Shore by Charlotte McConaughey. So good. I was like reading this in the airport, like holding it, you know, one of those books. Yeah. It's a book that is so many things. I mean, it's a love story. It's a mystery.

[13:03]Sarah Gelman: It's climate fiction and manages to be all those these things in a really subtle way. And this is actually the top of our list for best books of the year so far in June. And it was recently picked as a Reese Book Club picks. Think it definitely has legs. And the plot is a mysterious woman washes the shore of this remote island off the coast of Antarctica and it's inhabited by one family and they are the custodians of the world's last precious seeds. It sets it sort of has a science fiction element to it, but it's a not so distant future, which is a little frightening. And it just as you mentioned, like, cannot put this book down. I mean, sort of sounds like, oh, climate fiction, but, yeah, she is really an amazing writer.

[13:45]Zibby Owens: Also about family and loss and relationships. Parenthood.

[13:49]Sarah Gelman: Parenthood. I mean, there's so much. I'm such a sucker for a book about sort of the lengths that a parent, particularly a mother, just because I am a mother, will go to for their children, and I loved

[14:00]Zibby Owens: how that is presented in this book. That's such a good way to say that. I also love that. Okay. Yeah. The The Emperor of Gladness by Ocean Vuong. Is that how you pronounce I know. I've read I read his Vuong. I think it's Ocean Vuong. Ocean Vuong. I could be mispronouncing

[14:15]Sarah Gelman: that. So this is a novel. It has a very quiet premise, but it is a very powerful book. So it is about a older woman and a young man who end up becoming housemates and the various ways that they literally and figuratively save each other's lives. And it really brings the unseen people in society to the forefront. The young man works at a restaurant that's sort of like a Boston market and his coworkers are just these amazing people that are sort of on the other and helping each other. Ultimately, they're very sad pieces of it, but it's ultimately very uplifting. Amazing. The Boys in the Light by Nina Wilner. Okay. Have you read this book? I honestly have not even heard of this book. I'm embarrassed to say. Oh, no. I love it when people haven't heard of books because then you can discover it, and we we told you. So okay. I'm gonna say I am a total fiction reader. I love memoir, but I love fiction. I'm not a huge non fiction reader. I do read it because it's part of my job, but I am the last person to rave about a history book focused on World War II and I loved this book. So this is a book that will transcend what you think you like. It is about three young men who are really boys. They're, I mean, they're barely out of teens and two are Americans, one is German and their lives are brought together in an unexpected way during World War II. And yes, there are atrocities in this book, but I will say that it is ultimately very uplifting. It's very hopeful. It is about brotherhood and perseverance and bravery. And I was crying at the end, but they were happy tears. It's really, really powerful. Okay.

[15:54]Zibby Owens: Good to know. Thank you. We talked about number two, which is the correspondent. And now we'll jump up to number one, Buckeye by Patrick Ryan.

[16:01]Sarah Gelman: Okay. This is so I read this while I was on vacation this past summer, and I actually got scolded by my friends that I was with for being antisocial because I could not put this book down. So it is an epic American novel. It's set between the timeframes of World War II and Vietnam. And it takes place in a fictional Ohio town centers on two families and the families are brought together by one incident. And the incident is sort of like tossing a pebble into a pond and the effects kind of ripple out for generations to come. It's just the author actually said about this book something that really resonated with the team and he said it after we had picked the book, but it's just it really makes you think it's that lives are not defined by the good deeds that we do, but really by how we deal with our mistakes. It's such a like truth about life and that is one of the themes of the book. And it just yes, it's technically historical fiction. Another genre that I tend not to love, but it really makes you think too about this period of time in America that the children of the people that served in World War I were fighting in World War II, and then their children were serving in Vietnam. And certain this, you know, really intense period of time that's bookended by these wars and what it did to those generations. Gosh. Okay. I love how you describe everything. It makes you It's so good. If you haven't read this, it's just and the the story of motherhood in this book too is amazing.

[17:33]Zibby Owens: Okay. Today's episode is sponsored by Quince. Summer always makes me rethink what I'm reaching for every day. Lighter fabrics, better materials, pieces that just feel good the moment you put them on and look effortless. That's why I keep coming back to quints. They focus on high quality essentials. Think breathable linen, soft organic cotton, washable silk, but without the luxury markup. It's that rare balance where everything feels elevated but still easy. Quince has beautiful everyday pieces like 100% European linen pants, dresses, and tops with styles starting at $32. Their denim is soft and easy to wear. I wear my jean jacket all the time. And their organic cotton sweaters are perfect for layering on cool summer nights. Everything at Quince is priced 50 to 80% less than similar brands. Quince works directly with ethical factories and cuts out the middlemen, so you're paying for quality, not brand markup. And it's not just clothing. Quince has really become a destination for elevated essentials across home, kitchen, bedding, and beyond, making it easy to bring a more premium feel into everyday life. In addition to my jean jacket, I recently got a white tank top dress with a beautiful cotton skirt that is absolutely gorgeous, and I can't wait for it to be warm enough so I can wear it every day, but it has been a cool spring. Elevate your summer wardrobe. Go to quince.com/zippy for free shipping on your order and three hundred and sixty five day returns. Now available in Canada too. That's quince.comzibby for free shipping and three sixty five day returns. Quince.comzibby.

[20:15]Zibby Owens: You also have I I have seven here. Were there more seven books that are your most anticipated? Did the Oh my gosh. Well

[20:23]Sarah Gelman: Did I get cut off? Hold hold on. No.

[20:26]Zibby Owens: I only got seven sent to me. So I've got seven of your top most anticipated books. Well,

[20:32]Sarah Gelman: I I didn't know how many you were willing to take. So I did send you seven, but I have a lot that I'm very excited about. So I will start with Crux by Gabrielle Talent. I actually this is a book that I have not read yet. And one of my colleagues just finished it and she was raving about it. This is coming out in January and she said that the female character in this book is one of the most alive characters she has ever read. And she just said it's such a great depiction of friendship. So I'm very excited to read this. A book that I have read and loved is Lost Lambs by Madeline Cash. This is another January book and it's a debut novel about a dysfunctional family who ends up. Their dysfunction works for them and again, I think I gravitate towards books that are ultimately sort of redeeming in some way. This is just a totally unique story told in a totally unique voice and it just a 100% works.

[21:29]Zibby Owens: I'm very excited for people to read this book because I think it's gonna be big. I was extremely excited to see Strangers by Belle Burton next. I thought you might like this Oh my gosh. I picked this for my book club already. I interviewed Belle actually today about it. Oh my gosh. I'm obsessed. What is she like? Oh, she's amazing. She's so lovely. She's, like, very self spoken and, you know, she's, you know, but but brilliant and thoughtful. I wasn't surprised when she said one of her main inspirations was Lily King. Right? Because they have they share some, like, kind of writing

[22:00]Sarah Gelman: style and the Yeah. Sort of despair. Yes. Yeah. That's funny we both had. I would describe her as very thoughtful too without having met her just from her writing. She's a very thoughtful, introspective person.

[22:12]Zibby Owens: And for those that have not looked at this book yet, this is a divorce memoir, which I also tend to like. Now we're, like, becoming caricatures of ourselves, This is, like, embarrassing. We don't only like divorce books, but, you know, they find a place.

[22:26]Sarah Gelman: They do. I mean, it's interesting to We're gonna get about pitched, like, a thousand divorce books each after this conversation. Probably. I do I do like divorce books. I do too. Do. This one this one is is special. I listened again. I had a advanced audio copy of this book, so I listened to her read it, which again was just a really powerful experience. And you hear the emotion in her voice, but this is a true story about her husband of twenty years. One day, a week into the pandemic basically just saying, I'm leaving. I don't want anything to do with our life. I don't want anything to do with our children. And he just leaves. And yes, is a very, she's a privileged person. She sort of is almost apologetic about that, but she is who she is and this could happen to anyone no matter their privilege. I think that's part of the scary piece of it. She goes through so many emotions. And I think with her background as a lawyer, she's able to examine things in both an emotional way and an unemotional way that was just so measured and fair. But it just it made me think. It put me in a mood. I'm gonna say that. That's not a bad thing, but it definitely put me in a headspace. Yep.

[23:34]Zibby Owens: Agreed. So good. Okay. Super Nintendo. I haven't even heard of this. Not on my radar at all. The game changing company that unlocked the power of play.

[23:43]Sarah Gelman: Yes. So this is a February book that I have not read yet, but I am looking forward to reading. And, you know, I like books about companies that have changed our lives. And I think, you know, I think back to being a child and having we had the Nintendo PowerPad. And I remember my brother and I like running on the PowerPad and, you jump and that was so revolutionary at the time like that was cutting edge. My kids are still they're playing Mario Brothers. They're playing. They're obsessed with Zelda. And the way that Nintendo has been able to build upon these franchises to evolve them over time, I think is just remarkable. So I'm really looking forward to learning more about the company. I do also think that I do wanna wow my kids with all my facts about Nintendo too. So I get it. Yes. Yeah. One of our favorite things, by the way, is going to the Nintendo store in Rock Center.

[24:34]Zibby Owens: So if you need an activity next time you're in New York, go to the Nintendo store, go to McNally Jackson across the street, have a hot chocolate.

[24:41]Sarah Gelman: Your day is best. Okay. I'm actually I am definitely doing that because my older son is incredibly hard to buy presents for, and he only wants the new Zelda game. And I just I'm like, let me buy you something else that is Zelda esque. Yep. So I'm gonna look there. That's a great idea. Thank you. No problem. This is not about us, by the way. This is another one of my book club picks. I mean, is like embarrassing. We I mean very similar taste. Yeah. That's good. So this is interconnected short stories which I happen to love. I love that you can take them separately, but together there's so much more and surprise surprise. It's about a dysfunctional family. My favorite genre and it kicks off with the death of someone in the family. And then you see different members of the family and how their lives are tied together. And the stories, I mean, you read them alone, they're just so sort of quietly beautiful and moving. But together, it's just such an interesting portrayal of a family and the give and take and the different personalities and what people see versus what people are. I think that's one of the really interesting themes of it is like how someone presents themselves versus how they're seen. Yep. That's a great way to describe it. The Golden Boy by Patricia Finn. This is a book that I have not read yet. This is a March book. And the editor, Reagan Arthur, who I think is so talented and was Ellen Hildebrand's editor for a long time reached out to me and said, you must read this book. And she even said something like the description might not hook you, but I need you to trust me on this. And so when someone says that and they know my taste, I definitely am looking forward to reading it. So this is just sort of a flag that this is a book that I'm looking forward to. Okay. And then your last recommendation here is Yesteryear by Carol Clare Burke. I haven't read yet and I'm dying to read and I'm so excited about it. Okay. I'm going to order you to just shut down your day right now and go read it. It is that I know. I can't wait. I can't wait. I just I almost can't talk about it because it was so unique. It was so amazing. I think it's gonna be a huge book. It should be a huge It's gonna be a huge book. Yeah. It is about a woman who is a like a farm influencer. And then she wakes up one day in the early 1800s living on the farm that she has in modern day. And it goes from there and it has so many themes. Obviously themes about social media and the way that people portray themselves versus the way they are themes of motherhood of femininity and masculinity. There's a theme about sort of traditional America and what's happening in our country now with different splits. Mean, there's just so much going on and the ending is just perfection. Like, sometimes you read this book that's kind of has a plot device or it's doing something and you think, oh, please let this be good in the end. Like let it leave a good taste in my mouth and it just was perfect. So I really I'm so excited about this book. I actually just emailed the publicist this morning and said love love love and one of my colleagues Annabel read this and she said I love that she said that she said I've been chasing the feeling ever since I finished this. Know that feeling when you read such a good book and it's hard to start something else because you just everything else kind of like not this is good but it's just not that book. So yes, huge praise for this book. I love it and I am excited for it to go on sale and hear what other people have to say. So when you read it later today, let me know what you mean. Very soon. Okay. I'm going to. Yeah.

[28:12]Zibby Owens: I have a book that I think you are going to love in particular Okay. Knowing knowing us. I'm just gonna Show it to you. You're gonna love this. It's called No One You Know by Emma Tortillo.

[28:22]Sarah Gelman: Okay. I'm writing it down. Very analog. No one you know.

[28:27]Zibby Owens: The way that she writes about family and marriage and motherhood, you're gonna just love it. It's just I love You're gonna love it. I I just know you're That gonna

[28:37]Sarah Gelman: that is is my favorite thing to read about. And I think like I often will think to myself, why do I love being inside of other people's lives like this? And I think it's because it allows you to kind of open your eyes to contextualize your own life. But also like I I don't want my family to be dysfunctional. I want my children to be incredibly well adjusted and happy, but I love reading about other kids that are dysfunctional and other mothers that are horrible. And also I just I think this idea of it's like the movie sliding doors, which is like my favorite movie. Right. My favorite. Have you read The Post Birthday World by Lionel Shriver, which is an older book? I

[29:14]Zibby Owens: have it. Did I read I know it's here somewhere.

[29:17]Sarah Gelman: Well, that's another one I'm gonna recommend to you. A backlist title. I think it came out in the early two thousands. I think I read it. Now I have to open it and look. Tell me more about it. Know I have Yes. It So it takes place in England and the first chapter is a woman on her birthday. And at the end of chapter one she makes a decision. And from that point or there is a decision presented to her and from that point on in the book there are two chapter twos, two chapter threes and visually they look different so you can keep track of them. But each one follows a track of she did or she didn't then

[29:52]Zibby Owens: at the end, you see what happens. I'm gonna give you one more recommendation. Oh my gosh. And actually, we we published this, so but I'm not saying this because we published it, but it is similar in that it's called start at the end. And it has a similar sliding doors feel to it by Emma Gray. You're gonna I'm gonna if we haven't sent it to you, I'm going to after this. Okay. You're gonna I just I love this idea in life, period, that Yes. You can make one decision, one choice. I know. And It affects you everything. Everything.

[30:21]Sarah Gelman: And it can be so small. It can be like changing your shoes and then something happens because you're five minutes late. To me, that is one of the most interesting conceits in life and in literature. So any book that deals with that, I'm gonna love.

[30:37]Zibby Owens: Yeah. You're gonna love it.

[30:39]Sarah Gelman: These books, I'm like, Sarah, how are I know. Okay. How are we gonna We're gonna well, let's do a reading retreat. We'll be in a cabin in the woods, but but both of us. So I think if an intruder comes, we can fight them off. And yeah, that's what I think to myself. I need some sort of reading sabbatical because as you know, you have kids, you have a job, you have a partner, life is busy and there are lots of obligations.

[31:04]Zibby Owens: I think it's a great problem to want to read more and to have too much to read, but also it's like, oh, I look around and it's like I know. Oh my goodness. Like, can just stop right now because there are so many I'm just dying to read that come in and I'm just like, oh my God, I have to stop everything and read this. And then, like, there's another one of those, and then I'm like, but But you can't. Yes. Exactly. At least we to have. I don't know. I don't know. Like, my kids and their friends, like, they're not reading like this. It's not the same. I don't know. Let's see. Maybe when they get older, the tides will turn. Is there can I ask you a question? Is there one book that you're giving as a gift to people this holiday? I

[31:41]Sarah Gelman: am recommending Heart the Lover a lot by Lily King. I feel like that's a gift. It's a beautiful cover too, so I feel like it makes a pretty gift. It is a beautiful cover. And it's I think it's good for men and women. Although it has a very feminine title and jacket, I do think that it's the book itself is appealing to men. Yeah. Also, I want it to be wonderful for moms. Like, anyone who's, like, in it, I'm giving it. Okay. Yeah. I need to read that. Yeah. I feel like I'm in it. Yeah. Yeah.

[32:10]Zibby Owens: Alright. Well, Sarah, oh my gosh. Obviously, could talk books with you all day. We have been doing this for years, and I hope it continues. And Me too. I long for the day when maybe our kids are older and we can actually go on a reading retreat and just sit there and read and talk about books. That would be really That'd be so great. I keep saying to my kids like, let's have do you remember sustained silent reading time, SSR in school? Did you have that? No. But my kids have snibs, stick your nose in a book. Oh, I love that. Maybe I should call it that because I'm like, SSR. And my kids are like, oh, mom, come I feel like SSR sounds too much like SSRI, you know? Yeah.

[32:45]Sarah Gelman: Also good, though. Also helpful. All

[32:48]Zibby Owens: right. Well, thank you so much, and here's the happy reading and happy holidays. Happy holidays. Okay. Bye. Bye. Thank you for listening to Totally Booked with Sibby, formerly moms don't have time to read books. If you loved the show, tell a friend, leave a review, follow me on Instagram at Zippy Owens, and spread the word. Thanks so much. Oh, and buy the books.